Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Pianist Corner Advice needed on practicing Jeux D'Eau....

I would like a few pointers on learning to play Ravel's Jeux D' Eau...

I'm learning this on my own. I'm a decent advanced adult player, but am not currently taking lessons. Thus far, the Ravel I've played are his "Pavane .." and Sonatine. (Btw, I do play another water piece-- Debussy's Reflects dans l'eau)

I bought two sheet music versions, one edited by Hinson, the other by Casadesus. Thus far, I prefer Casadesus' fingering overall, but, since I have small hands, for a given passage I generally need to choose fingering best suited to my situation. (I'll NEVER attempt La Campanella!!)

I had a discussion with a a piano professor once who said Jeux D' Eau is easily manageable with the right fingering, especially if one "cheats" with the left hand a lot, more than the editor would indicate...
Since I'm just starting this piece, can anyone here give me info. on 1) the specific passages one might "cheat" with the left hand, and 2) practicing tips in general.
Thanks...

hockeyguy,

I've just started working on this piece as well. (And, by coincidence, I also bought two editions, one of which is Hinson's.)

I'm a big fan of hand redistribution in general (not cheating I think, even in quotes ), but I was surprised to see that I do little of it here, even though the hands are often very close together. I allow the RH to play the B in the last beat of m.51 and 52. I split up the figure in the first beat of m.55 (and m.59). I do one odd redistribution: in m.9 I use my LH to play the last note of beats 2 and 4 (the E), only because those 4-5 stretches are difficult for my RH. These are all pretty minor, though.

I've found that what people say about this piece is true: it's hard, but not as hard as you think when you first read it.

I think this thread might live longer if you ask specific questions, like fingering on specific passages, rather than just soliciting general "practice tips".

-J

I've recently started playing this piece too. I personally feel it's very hard to give broad sweeping advice on it without knowing what sorts of things give you trouble. You'd be better off starting to learn it, see how you go and then get back to us with specific questions about specific passages.

There are numerous recordings of people playing this on Youtube - some very very clear video above the hands. That might give you some pointers.

Here are a few, all played by small handed people. The first one is the best:

Played very well, with excellent view of the hands:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pfDPRuyhq6k&feature=related

Played very and slow so you can see everything:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qja3pWlk7YE&feature=related

Played too fast, but good view of left hand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CZ2jV1GQcVE

My fingerings would be of little use to you because I have a very big hand span - and I use it to avoid sticky situations!

Good luck with it all.

Thx for the videos, ando. I just jumped around in the 2nd one, and there's some interesting hand redistribution at the end (m.82-83). Seems unnecessary after what's just come, but still interesting.

-J

Thanks for the replies, and especially the videos.
Interesting how the three videos are very different, especially in regards to tempo...

This piece sounds great on the Yamahas. I think Ravel (and Debussy) pieces are well-suited for the Yamaha sound. (In my opinion, the best piano for Ravel/Debussy is Bosendorfer. I personally don't think the Steinway sound works as well for these composers).

That is true. It sounds better on my Yamaha than it does on my mother's Steinway. Pieces like this need a certain level of crispness/brightness. The Steinway kills the Yamaha for Beethoven though.

Hey I used to play it and I have fairly small hands as well. I don't think I have cheated a lot in this piece though - the only cheat I have used is in bar 81 last beat where I have made the LH play the C sharp. I agree it is easier than it sounds, but I did take lots of effort to figure out the suitable fingering for you (well maybe that's because I've got the version with no fingering at all!)

[/quote]

That is true. It sounds better on my Yamaha than it does on my mother's Steinway. Pieces like this need a certain level of crispness/brightness. The Steinway kills the Yamaha for Beethoven though. [/quote]

Yes, I agree with that too. I'm fortunate to play 2 pianos--a steinway L and a bosendorfer 225. In terms of classical music, I prefer the Steinway sound for:

Beethoven
Rachmaninoff
All the other Russians too
Gershwin
Grieg
Schumann
Brahms

I prefer the Bosendorfer sound for:

Ravel
Debussy
Mozart
Bach
Scarlatti
Schubert

Chopin and Liszt-- tough call, depends on the piece, but Liszt leans Steinway for sure...
Chopin sounds great on both, but I lean Steinway here too, although some of his delicate nocturnes when played on the Bosie makes one weep (whereas nothing played on a Steinway makes one weep...lol)

the funny thing is that Ravel knew very very well how to write for the instrument, if there is one composer who needs no cheating: it's Ravel!

I would like to play Ravel's Jeux d'Eau, but find it difficult to reach some of the notes and still play fluently. I have read that the LudwigMasters Edition makes this piece easier to play, but cannot find the edition on the internet. Any suggestions where I can find it?

Here.

I've never looked at it, though, so I can't vouch for any editorial suggestions that would make it easier to play.

BTW, I am not sure if they've changed the name recently, but that company's piano music is usually found under the name "Masters Music". Be aware that they also have an unedited reprint of this piece - don't get it by mistake.

Regarding edition...

http://store.shopping.yahoo.co.jp/musicbook/9784276435315.html?sc_e=sydr_sspd

edited by Vlado Perlemuter, who is generally considered a good reference of Ravel music, as he studied with Ravel for some time (I forgot the actual duration).

Sorry, the link is in Japanese. I believe that the Japanese publisher actually purchased the copyrights/licence from the Western owner (though I cannot find by typing "Ravel Jeux d'eau piano score Perlemuter" on google).

The Jeux D'eau edition I stated above (as well as other Ravel works of the same Japanese publisher) had printed marks/remarks added by Perlemuter based on his scores/notes when he studied with Ravel. Nonetheless, that doesn't say one must strictly follow Perlemuter, again, just good reference.