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August Förster project piano #1748807
09/08/11 10:41 AM
09/08/11 10:41 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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I've sold my Petrof, as I am in financial troubles. But I bought an August Förster at 1/5th of the price I sold the Petrof.

Here are the pictures: August Förster

It has a very nice picture of Lobau, Germany and the piano factory on the sound board, where almost no-one can see it!

It has a very nice tone, despite the bad shape of the hammer heads, and a very deep bass for such a small piano, 1.16 mts tall (45 and a half inches).

It tunes nice clean unisons in the tenor and bass, but it has some false beats in the treble.

At first I bought it to rebuild it and sell it, but now that I've played this fine instrument I just can not sell it. So I am going to restore it and keep it with me for my own pleasure! Both pleasures: restoring it and playing it.

I am curious about the action. Can someone tell me if it is a Renner action?

All comments will be greatly appreciated.


Last edited by Gadzar; 09/08/11 10:49 AM.

Rafael Melo
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rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

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Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1748817
09/08/11 10:52 AM
09/08/11 10:52 AM
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Suffolk, England
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Withindale Offline
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Originally Posted by Gadzar
Can someone tell me if it is a Renner action


Looks possible. Renner sometimes stamped on the action rail. Some German makers put their own actions together from Renner parts.

Ian


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1748827
09/08/11 11:14 AM
09/08/11 11:14 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
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Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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I've seen some Renner hammers that have stamped the words "LOUIS RENNER" on the moldings.

But in this case there is no stamping.



Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1748890
09/08/11 01:05 PM
09/08/11 01:05 PM
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Vancouver B. C. Canada
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Originally Posted by Gadzar
I've seen some Renner hammers that have stamped the words "LOUIS RENNER" on the moldings.


That would be a Renner hammer set. Looks like a Schwander or Schwander type action from here.

Renner made a Schwander style action for grand’s; most likely they had one for uprights too.

Most Renner actions I have come across have a label of some sort.


Dan Silverwood
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Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1748909
09/08/11 01:32 PM
09/08/11 01:32 PM
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Posts: 760
Zichron Yaacov, Israel
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Steve Jackson Offline
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I doubt that's a Renner. Maybe Langer or one of the many other action makers from the good old days.

Steve

Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1749193
09/08/11 10:23 PM
09/08/11 10:23 PM
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Posts: 3,919
Vancouver Island, BC, Canada
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What year is the piano? You took pictures of eery small detail except for one important one - the serial number. shocked

The action is a very typical example of upright actions built by a number of companies in Germany throughout the decades. If the action rail or hammers do not have a Renner stamp, it is highly unlikely they are made by Renner. The whole thing looks very much like an East German product to me.

Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Supply] #1749308
09/09/11 03:32 AM
09/09/11 03:32 AM
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Suffolk, England
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Now there are more detailed pictures on Picasa, I am not so sure about Renner. The screws (though they could have been changed) and various details differ from the actions I had in mind.

Ian


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Supply] #1749648
09/09/11 03:03 PM
09/09/11 03:03 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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Gadzar  Offline OP
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Mexico City
Originally Posted by Supply
What year is the piano? You took pictures of eery small detail except for one important one - the serial number. shocked


[Linked Image]

My fault, in fact I didn't forget the serial number, the picture is there, but I ommited to explain it is the serial number, which is 84188. It is stamped in several places of the piano and this one is the most visible of all, though in an unusual place!

That puts the manufacture year of this piano between 1948 and 1952.

Last edited by Gadzar; 09/09/11 03:19 PM.

Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Steve Jackson] #1749958
09/10/11 01:33 AM
09/10/11 01:33 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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Mexico City
Originally Posted by Steve Jackson

I doubt that's a Renner. Maybe Langer or one of the many other action makers from the good old days.

Steve


A friend of mine told me also that it looks like a Langer.


I don't know the Langer brand. It is the first time I hear about it.

From what I understand it is not produced anymore, was it a good action?



Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750081
09/10/11 10:09 AM
09/10/11 10:09 AM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Vancouver B. C. Canada
Silverwood Pianos Offline
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As good as any other.


Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
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"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750138
09/10/11 11:35 AM
09/10/11 11:35 AM
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 332
Europe
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pianolive Offline
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It could very well be an action from Flemming.

Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Silverwood Pianos] #1750345
09/10/11 08:21 PM
09/10/11 08:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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Gadzar  Offline OP
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Mexico City
Originally Posted by Silverwood Pianos

As good as any other.


I have googled Langer piano action, and all I can read is that it is a British company formed by Herburger & Brooks and Schwander and is currently out of bussines.

As good as any other?

I have heard often that Renner makes top quality products. That indirectly implies there are other brands with less quality. So, how about Langer?



Last edited by Gadzar; 09/11/11 02:54 AM.

Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750546
09/11/11 06:08 AM
09/11/11 06:08 AM
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Posts: 332
Europe
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pianolive Offline
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If your piano is build 1945 - 1989 the action is a Flemming.
That is what they used in the DDR - there was no import from the west side.
In later years Förster reconstructed the instruments and now use Renner actions.

Even C.Bechstein made a baby grand Mod K with a Flemming action.

Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750627
09/11/11 10:14 AM
09/11/11 10:14 AM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Vancouver B. C. Canada
Silverwood Pianos Offline
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Originally Posted by Gadzar

I have heard often that Renner makes top quality products. That indirectly implies there are other brands with less quality. So, how about Langer?


Herrburger Schwander made good piano actions; as good as any other action maker. In reality an action is an action. It is how the action is set up and by whom which makes it perform correctly. I have come across good actions that have been set up poorly and poorly made actions set up properly that play well……..

Originally Posted by pianolive
If your piano is build 1945 - 1989 the action is a Flemming.
That is what they used in the DDR - there was no import from the west side.
In later years Förster reconstructed the instruments and now use Renner actions.
Even C.Bechstein made a baby grand Mod K with a Flemming action.

Lots of companies used the Flemming action; Zimmerman, Bechstein, Forster, Calisia, Blüthner for example. In the case of Blüthner, the instruments that were shipped to the west had a Renner action installed.


Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
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"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Silverwood Pianos] #1750709
09/11/11 01:16 PM
09/11/11 01:16 PM
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Europe
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Dan,

Have you seen DDR Blüthner grands with Renner actions? If so that is really interesting!
I serve some Blüthner 6 from 69-73 and all of them have Flemming actions.

Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750732
09/11/11 01:50 PM
09/11/11 01:50 PM
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,511
Suffolk, England
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Withindale Offline
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Suffolk, England
Here is a post in German about Flemming mechanics in an August Förster grand piano.

Ian


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1750772
09/11/11 03:06 PM
09/11/11 03:06 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,263
Vancouver B. C. Canada
Silverwood Pianos Offline
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Originally Posted by pianolive
Dan,
Have you seen DDR Blüthner grands with Renner actions? If so that is really interesting!
I serve some Blüthner 6 from 69-73 and all of them have Flemming actions.

There were a number of DDR Blüthner grand’s that came here during the late 70’s early 80’s when one of the dealerships here was representing the Blüthner line.

One of the problems encountered here was the fact that practically nobody knew who or what these instruments were, so they were a difficult sell for the dealer who never attempted to bring in any more.

All of the Blüthner models scheduled to come over to the west had the Renner action installed; at least the ones that made it to N. America did; this is my understanding when I asked.

I have read the same posted on the Piano Forum (UK); could have been a posting by Barry Heaton or Bill Kibby-Johnson……

One of my colleagues here, Rod Verhnjak at Verhnjak Pianos had one a while back; it was a 1982 Mod 6’ with the Renner action and Renner hammer set.

The one I have here is a 1979 Mod 6’ with the Renner action but the hammer set is from somebody else. I would have to pull the action to recall the name stamped on the side, but it is a name I have not come across.

Here is a photo set of the Blüthner I have here.

BluthnerAliqoutTour

Anyways we should get back to the Forster discussion so as not to destroy Raphaels' thread


Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
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"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Silverwood Pianos] #1751205
09/12/11 09:15 AM
09/12/11 09:15 AM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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Mexico City
Originally Posted by Silverwood Pianos
Anyways we should get back to the Forster discussion so as not to destroy Raphaels' thread


Oh Dan, you can continue to speak about actions from around the world! I am enjoying it and learning and I think my thread is not being destroyed but enriched.


Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: pianolive] #1751743
09/13/11 08:01 AM
09/13/11 08:01 AM
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Posts: 461
Münster, Germany
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Originally Posted by pianolive
If your piano is build 1945 - 1989 the action is a Flemming.
That is what they used in the DDR


Not only Flemming. There was an action (at least in uprights) called Pianic.

Gregor


piano tech - tuner - dealer
Münster, Germany
www.weldert.de
Re: August Förster project piano [Re: Gadzar] #1753761
09/16/11 07:27 PM
09/16/11 07:27 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,758
Mexico City
Gadzar Offline OP
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Mexico City
The piano is now refinished. It is not perfect, but it looks nice now.

August Förster refinished


I ve also installed the missing strings. But I'am no very happy with them. The unisons can not be tuned absolutely clean like their neighbors.

I am thinking to replace both strings of each unison, in order to guarant the quality of the unisons, but I fear the new strings will stick out from the rest, sounding too brilliant.



Rafael Melo
Piano Technician
rafaelmelo@afinacionpianos.com.mx

Serving Mexico City and suburbs.

http://www.afinacionpianos.com.mx
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