Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
What's Hot!!
Happy Thanksgiving!

Happy Thanksgiving from our family to our Forums Family!

Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Fall 2017
Who's Online Now
56 registered members (AprilE, Andrew_G, Beemer, al reds, BachToTheFuture, Almaviva, 15 invisible), 1,788 guests, and 2 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1746276 - 09/04/11 12:59 PM Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice)  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
feebeeliszt Offline
Full Member
feebeeliszt  Offline
Full Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
London
Have been working on this since August (unfortunately) without a teacher. It makes me feel very unsafe as I have no idea if I am on the right track.

May you please give me some comments? I have recorded the beginning and the end of the 3rd movement only due to lack of time. For the passage with right hand semiquavers, I am so unsure if I am playing it with the right movement as I think I have heard lumps in the videos.




http://www.youtube.com/user/feebeeliszt
The notes I handle no better than many pianists. But the pauses between the notes - ah, that is where the art resides! - Schnabel
#1746288 - 09/04/11 01:12 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
This is a HARD piece. Kudos for you taking it on.

It sounds fine to me. Your sense of long line is great, overall the projection of the top voice isn't bad, maybe continue to focus on that some more, and the fast runny notes are coming out pretty well, keep up the slow practice and proper sinking and transferring of your arm weight into each note!

In the second video, how come your wrists are so high when you play the octaves?

You have a good sound and feel for this piece. I can't wait to hear the final product. By the way, that's a cute image in the first video, haha. smile

#1746302 - 09/04/11 01:36 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 22,769
pianoloverus Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
pianoloverus  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2001
Posts: 22,769
New York City
According to your profile, you're 111 years old. So I'd have to say that's quite an amazing performance!!

#1746356 - 09/04/11 03:09 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Maybe it's in dog years. She is actually 24 years and 6 months! laugh

#1746479 - 09/04/11 07:41 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Orange Soda King]  
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
liszt85 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
liszt85  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
Originally Posted by Orange Soda King

In the second video, how come your wrists are so high when you play the octaves?


+1. I've noticed this in other videos of young PW pianists (can't recall exactly who now). Is this the octave technique that's taught in a specific school of piano playing (Russian?)? Is this a more ergonomic way to play octaves? I just bought myself a book of octave technique (50 studies). I now need to know how to play octaves. laugh (No book tells you that precisely, need to find a good teacher for that).


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1746481 - 09/04/11 07:44 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Orange Soda King]  
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
liszt85 Offline
3000 Post Club Member
liszt85  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
You play extremely well, that goes without saying! I can only hope that I play this well some day. :P Good luck, PW awaits the final product on this piece from you. The teaser did its job!


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1746513 - 09/04/11 09:02 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: liszt85]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
liszt85, I actually now remember her talking about her having small hands (smaller than mine, actually).

I don't think it has much to do with technique training. Although I do not want to jump to conclusions about Ms. feebeeliszt's background in technique, I think high wrists with octaves is what immediately feels comfortable to people who haven't really been showed what's proper and taken the time and effort to practice. I experimented by doing fast 9ths, and my wrists were still not as high. (fbl, please forgive me if I am incorrect!)

I basically learned how to do octaves by watching Jack Gibbons play Alkan's Allegro Barbaro and reading a comment he posted to one other YouTube user who attempted the piece.

#1746524 - 09/04/11 09:10 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Orange Soda King]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
feebeeliszt Offline
Full Member
feebeeliszt  Offline
Full Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
London
Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
liszt85, I actually now remember her talking about her having small hands (smaller than mine, actually).

I don't think it has much to do with technique training. Although I do not want to jump to conclusions about Ms. feebeeliszt's background in technique, I think high wrists with octaves is what immediately feels comfortable to people who haven't really been showed what's proper and taken the time and effort to practice. I experimented by doing fast 9ths, and my wrists were still not as high. (fbl, please forgive me if I am incorrect!)

I basically learned how to do octaves by watching Jack Gibbons play Alkan's Allegro Barbaro and reading a comment he posted to one other YouTube user who attempted the piece.


L85, I need to learn the proper way of doing octaves as well. help I think I have been playing them like this all my life. But since my teacher didn't complain, I assumed that it's okay...


http://www.youtube.com/user/feebeeliszt
The notes I handle no better than many pianists. But the pauses between the notes - ah, that is where the art resides! - Schnabel
#1746531 - 09/04/11 09:23 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Yeah, I had to change my technique over the summer (like, for scales and arpeggios and figures like that). I think I am getting the hang of it now, but it's still undergoing refinement.

#1746545 - 09/04/11 09:43 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Orange Soda King]  
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Damon  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 6,629
Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
I think high wrists with octaves is what immediately feels comfortable to people who haven't really been showed what's proper and taken the time and effort to practice.


I kind of marveled at the high wrists. I froze the video in the middle of one of those octaves and I couldn't make that hand shape if you held a gun to my head. FBL is obviously more flexible than me but I don't know how that translates to octave technique. What does Mr. Gibbons say?

#1746547 - 09/04/11 09:47 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Kuanpiano  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Canada
It's not the high wrists that are unusual, but how the hands immediately are flat with very curved fingers. Lots of pianists use high wrists for octaves...though she curls her fingers quite a bit in comparison to other pianists I've seen before..

Though she plays very well! (much better than me, if you can find anything of mine on youtube..)Though I remember, feebee, that you had many more videos on youtube?? What did they go! shocked

Last edited by Kuanpiano; 09/04/11 09:50 PM.

Working on:
Chopin - Nocturne op. 48 no.1
Debussy - Images Book II

#1746549 - 09/04/11 09:49 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Damon: It's all here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qp1Qh4oskY
I feel that it translates to octave technique, because... well, I won't explain. I'll just propose that you play the ending of Liszt's HR6 with high wrists, and then again with the wrist parallel with the arm. Like in THIS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r49pIDj0hEI

Kuanpiano: I'm not sure if the curling of fingers by itself makes problems with tension, but having tension in the fingers does cause problems with tension in the wrist, arm, elbow, etc.
EDIT: And yes, her older videos are gone. frown

Last edited by Orange Soda King; 09/04/11 09:54 PM.
#1746553 - 09/04/11 09:54 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Orange Soda King]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Kuanpiano  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Canada
Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
It's all here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3qp1Qh4oskY

I feel that it translates to octave technique, because... well, I won't explain. I'll just propose that you play the ending of Liszt's HR6 with high wrists, and then again with the wrist parallel with the arm. Like in THIS video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r49pIDj0hEI

Gibbon's octaves...I think he'd use a different technique for the HR6 (I would too). The Allegro Barbaro is mostly moving, forceful octaves. It's quite different with an endless stream of light, repeated octaves in a stationary position.

I thought I was good at octaves (like in Chopin's 3rd scherzo, or in Chasse-neige, and even the Heroic Polonaise), but the HR6 and the Liszt Sonata totally proved me wrong this summer..

edit: I'm not saying her technique is wrong (I'm no teacher ;D), but it's just a bit unorthodox.

Last edited by Kuanpiano; 09/04/11 09:55 PM.

Working on:
Chopin - Nocturne op. 48 no.1
Debussy - Images Book II

#1746555 - 09/04/11 09:55 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Kuanpiano]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
Kuanopiano, HR6, just for fun: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-kv6v8Boh94 crazy

#1746557 - 09/04/11 10:00 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Kuanpiano  Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 2,194
Canada
That guy wrecks everything he plays laugh

Though you can tell he has his wrist high up and has his hand angled downwards. Or at least his right hand, his left hand looks a bit weird.

My Favourite Hungarian Rhapsody 6 is...Horowitz or Cziffra. Cziffra gets the mood right for the lively sections, and his rhythm makes the end so exciting! Horowitz sort of powers through it all, which is seriously scary. There used to be on youtube a live recording of him playing it in 1953, his last year concertizing before his 12 year retirement. Absolutely the best ever!!

And wow, we seem to be talking in edits for half of this thread! :P

And SCHUBERT'S D960!? So amazing!! Richter plays it like nobody else (at least before him, but nobody can come close to him when it comes to his vision of Schubert's last sonata). How does Schubert (and Richter) make B flat major so tragic?


Working on:
Chopin - Nocturne op. 48 no.1
Debussy - Images Book II

#1746559 - 09/04/11 10:07 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: Kuanpiano]  
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Orange Soda King Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Happy Birthday Orange Soda King  Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 6,734
Louisville, Kentucky, United S...
We've totally hijacked the thread, hahahaha. I don't think I'll be playing the Schubert anytime soon. But it's SO great!!

Talking in edits is fun, hehe.

I haven't listened to HR6 in a long time. The Liszt I've been listening to is Dante Sonata (the recording you posted) and Venezia e Napoli (Hamelin).

I hacked my way through the B flat major part of HR6 a year and a half ago just for fun though, hehe.

EDIT: Speaking of talking in edits, I noticed that you mentioned you're not working with a teacher? Do you mean you don't have a teacher, or just with this piece?

Last edited by Orange Soda King; 09/04/11 11:17 PM.
#1747186 - 09/05/11 09:46 PM Re: Mendelssohn Piano Concerto 1 (fragments of practice) [Re: feebeeliszt]  
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
feebeeliszt Offline
Full Member
feebeeliszt  Offline
Full Member

Joined: May 2010
Posts: 414
London
Bach BWV 883 Prelude 14


Fugue (my camera battery died after I've played 2 pages..)


http://www.youtube.com/user/feebeeliszt
The notes I handle no better than many pianists. But the pauses between the notes - ah, that is where the art resides! - Schnabel

Moderated by  Kreisler 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
(ad)
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Pearl River Pianos
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq 6 Out now
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


New Topics - Multiple Forums
Kawai es110 /kawai es100
by Jitin. 11/23/17 07:22 PM
Midway crisis
by Martin3451. 11/23/17 07:10 PM
VST discount this Thanksgiving 2017
by TonyDIGITAL. 11/23/17 02:58 PM
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics182,909
Posts2,673,860
Members89,177
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0