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#1729764 - 08/09/11 11:11 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Kuanpiano]  
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Originally Posted by Kuanpiano
Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by How you doing?
I don't find the dress inappropriate at all. In comparison to other dresses worn in other musical fields this is nothing. I think some people are just a bit more old fashioned or used to a specific type of attire. This is definitely a more daring dress for a classical musician, but it is hardly anything bad compared to what other stars in other fields wear. I think people should let loose a little bit more. Also, the dress looks nice in my opinion. I think she wore it cause it looked nice not to attract negative attention.


Like a bathing suit, showing most of her body, just hang up a purse and she's a walking tramp, I can't even begin to think how in the world you dont find her dress inappropriate? what's inappropriate then according to your standards?

Total nudity?

What she did was not innocent...

She demonstrated to all that there is nothing wrong with it, and it showed her world outlook and her extreme liberal views, she walked and dressed her 'religion', beliefs and attitudes and viewpoints, a picture says a thousand words, and she has demonstrated in the clearest of terms where her mind and thoughts and beliefs are, and they stand in complete opposition to how I want the world to look. I want more modesty, a more humble spirit, more refined character, and restraint, not the celebration of the human body and the physical but just the opposite, placing the spiritual above the physical...

Don't be naive, these are all messages communicated by those who try to 'wear' their views, ideas, and beliefs...


Go watch an interview with her - she'd totally be the kind of person to say "wow what a gorgeous dress!!" and then put it on and perform with it. Seriously, I don't think she's out to woo audiences with her looks if that's what you're thinking.

And if you're going to judge her music playing based on her concert attire...well turn up the music and listen without watching - if you didn't like her playing in the first place then why listen? But if you take a listen, then maybe what she's communicating with convince you that she's not some you-know-what that you hate so much.


For me, I didnt see Yuja coming down the stage but a cheap hooker. Let her dress like a decent lady and I will be her number one fan. I'm no fan of hookers. Her dress is a disgrace.


Last edited by Saul; 08/09/11 11:12 PM.
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#1729765 - 08/09/11 11:12 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Andromaque]  
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^^^Not a very pleasant way to make your 666th post...


Working on:
Chopin - Nocturne op. 48 no.1
Debussy - Images Book II

#1729766 - 08/09/11 11:12 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: liszt85]  
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Originally Posted by liszt85
If one cannot focus on the music when a girl wearing a short dress plays the piano, that's the person's problem.. not the girl's. That's what you choose to focus on and that's your problem and your problem alone.


+1

Consider it a challenge to yourself. I say you'll gain more by contemplating that - no matter the outcome - than you ever would by objecting.

Edit: addressed to no one in particular. I should have said "one" instead of "you."

Last edited by jmcintyre; 08/09/11 11:22 PM.

I'd rather be practicing wink
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Now: Brahms Op. 118, Bach French Suite #5
#1729767 - 08/09/11 11:13 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul


for showing your body like that will get you only the bad kind of fans, those who will care only about your legs and not about your fingers.



The irony! You decided not to listen to her play because you couldn't focus on the music because of the dress.. you couldn't stop thinking about tramps and "hookers". You are the bad kind of fan that she should probably seek to avoid, and I see that she's already been successful. Seeing that dress, all I thought was "Wow, that's gorgeous and she's a good looking pianist", not "Wow, she looks like a wh**e". The latter is what you seem to be focused on.

Your intolerant and bordering-on-tyrannical stance here has lowered you so much in my esteem. Not that you'd care, just thought you should know.


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
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#1729769 - 08/09/11 11:14 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Andromaque]  
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Originally Posted by Andromaque
You are flirting with racism


The only racism I saw was in Badorange's post.

#1729770 - 08/09/11 11:14 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Kuanpiano]  
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Originally Posted by Kuanpiano
^^^Not a very pleasant way to make your 666th post...


Actually its the best way, putting down evil, wickedness and profanity is one of the most noble things that a anyone can do.

#1729771 - 08/09/11 11:16 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by Kuanpiano
^^^Not a very pleasant way to make your 666th post...


Actually its the best way, putting down evil, wickedness and profanity is one of the most noble things that a anyone can do.


The other thing to consider Saul, is that you're representing you country too on a public forum like this. When people like you come out with such scathing comments, intolerant and tyrannical ones, it does shape the world's opinion about the part of the world you come from. I know its not ideal but that does happen you know? So later when people generalize and say "People from Saul's country are so uptight.. they are just intolerant and have a bad attitude towards women", realize that you were a direct cause for that perception to have developed.


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1729772 - 08/09/11 11:18 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: liszt85]  
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Originally Posted by liszt85
Originally Posted by Saul


for showing your body like that will get you only the bad kind of fans, those who will care only about your legs and not about your fingers.



The irony! You decided not to listen to her play because you couldn't focus on the music because of the dress.. you couldn't stop thinking about tramps and "hookers". You are the bad kind of fan that she should probably seek to avoid, and I see that she's already been successful. Seeing that dress, all I thought was "Wow, that's gorgeous and she's a good looking pianist", not "Wow, she looks like a wh**e". The latter is what you seem to be focused on.

Your intolerant and bordering-on-tyrannical stance here has lowered you so much in my esteem. Not that you'd care, just thought you should know.


Interesting philosophy you have there...'attack those who fight profanities'...

So I'm the bad guy for wanting women to have more dignity and self esteem and value then to cave in to the Porn Age poisonous fumes that contaminated our world?

Such a travesty of justice and a twisted view of things you have.

#1729773 - 08/09/11 11:20 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Andromaque]  
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♪oron♪o, on♪ario, canada...
I don't think there is anything "indecent" about her dress, although the style is more suitable for e.g. a poolside cocktail party than a concert.

And I completely agree with BB Player.

It doesn't matter whether you wrap yourself up like a Muslim, or are in black suit or in a bikini. If you are good you are good. If you are bad, you are bad. There is no such thing as "she plays well, but I hate her dress so she is bad".
Grow up people!


♫♫♫ ♫♫♫
YAMAHA C2M PE
#1729774 - 08/09/11 11:21 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Andromaque]  
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Heck --- Yuja is just an old fashioned girl paying homage to the miniskirt fashion craze of the late 1960s. Back then, thousands of respectable young (and not so young) women wore those skirts, and it was considered quite acceptable. However, it was not universally condoned by all segments of society.....human nature being what it is.



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#1729776 - 08/09/11 11:22 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: liszt85]  
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Originally Posted by liszt85
Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by Kuanpiano
^^^Not a very pleasant way to make your 666th post...


Actually its the best way, putting down evil, wickedness and profanity is one of the most noble things that a anyone can do.


The other thing to consider Saul, is that you're representing you country too on a public forum like this. When people like you come out with such scathing comments, intolerant and tyrannical ones, it does shape the world's opinion about the part of the world you come from. I know its not ideal but that does happen you know? So later when people generalize and say "People from Saul's country are so uptight.. they are just intolerant and have a bad attitude towards women", realize that you were a direct cause for that perception to have developed.


I'm not uptight about anything. I'm telling you the truth. Women are above all these, they should be more respectful to themselves, by presenting themselves with certain dignity and class. I'm on their side, I want them to be appreciated, but for the right reasons, for their talents and charm, and real inner beauty, not the unsolicited tramp-like flaunting of their bodies to seek attention.

#1729780 - 08/09/11 11:29 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Artists push limits.
I think it's fine for female artists to push the limits of attire.

BTW, I see that the original article mentions Eve Queler. I hadn't known that she was someone who 'pushed those limits' in earlier days, even though I sort of know her: She and her family live near us, and we often see her daughter Liz (a performer herself) and son-in-law (a pianist) at the weekly softball game. smile

Eve will be performing up there in a couple of weeks, and we're going.

#1729781 - 08/09/11 11:29 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: pno]  
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Originally Posted by pno
I don't think there is anything "indecent" about her dress, although the style is more suitable for e.g. a poolside cocktail party than a concert.

And I completely agree with BB Player.

It doesn't matter whether you wrap yourself up like a Muslim, or are in black suit or in a bikini. If you are good you are good. If you are bad, you are bad. There is no such thing as "she plays well, but I hate her dress so she is bad".
Grow up people!


You're more then Welcome to enjoy Stalin's piano playing even if he was great as a pianist, I would have never been able to disassociate him for what he did. No one can separate the person from the artist. Its impossible. Evil always finds a way to appear even when performing music, the wicked cant shut out his wickedness when playing, and therefore he contaminates everything he does, like a dark spirit it envelopes its listeners and viewers.

For me an artist is a human being, not some kind of a game or a robot that I can separate according to my likes or dislikes. It just doesn’t work this way.


#1729783 - 08/09/11 11:32 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul

So I'm the bad guy [...] ?


In my view? Yes.


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1729784 - 08/09/11 11:35 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by pno
I don't think there is anything "indecent" about her dress, although the style is more suitable for e.g. a poolside cocktail party than a concert.

And I completely agree with BB Player.

It doesn't matter whether you wrap yourself up like a Muslim, or are in black suit or in a bikini. If you are good you are good. If you are bad, you are bad. There is no such thing as "she plays well, but I hate her dress so she is bad".
Grow up people!


You're more then Welcome to enjoy Stalin's piano playing even if he was great as a pianist, I would have never been able to disassociate him for what he did. No one can separate the person from the artist. Its impossible. Evil always finds a way to appear even when performing music, the wicked cant shut out his wickedness when playing, and therefore he contaminates everything he does, like a dark spirit it envelopes its listeners and viewers.

For me an artist is a human being, not some kind of a game or a robot that I can separate according to my likes or dislikes. It just doesn’t work this way.



Then it is really your own issue. I can offer no help.


♫♫♫ ♫♫♫
YAMAHA C2M PE
#1729785 - 08/09/11 11:35 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Mark_C]  
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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Artists push limits.
I think it's fine for female artists to push the limits of attire.

BTW, I see that the original article mentions Eve Queler. I hadn't known that she was someone who 'pushed those limits' in earlier days, even though I sort of know her: She and her family live near us, and we often see her daughter Liz (a performer herself) and son-in-law (a pianist) at the weekly softball game. smile


Let her come out naked then, let her push it to the end, what's the problem ? if you show 80 percent of your body to complete strangers, why not go all the way? what's stopping her?

What stops her is the inner feeling and thought and realization that in her heart of hearts she knows that she is doing something wrong to firstly herself and then to others. Otherwise if its good why not all the way?

She understands that its inappropriate to do it, but she caved in to the pressures of a world growing more and more profane.

And as such she 'pushed the limit' as you suggested, but it makes no sense to stop it there, if its so good according to some here.

Let her 'push the limit' let her press it till the end, if what she is doing is so great and beautiful...

The fact that she doesn’t most vividly demonstrates that her actions are negative and deplorable, and that's all I'm saying.

Listen to your heart of hearts, listen to what is truly right and good, dont cave in, you know what's really good and proper.

Last edited by Saul; 08/09/11 11:47 PM.
#1729786 - 08/09/11 11:36 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by pno
I don't think there is anything "indecent" about her dress, although the style is more suitable for e.g. a poolside cocktail party than a concert.

And I completely agree with BB Player.

It doesn't matter whether you wrap yourself up like a Muslim, or are in black suit or in a bikini. If you are good you are good. If you are bad, you are bad. There is no such thing as "she plays well, but I hate her dress so she is bad".
Grow up people!


You're more then Welcome to enjoy Stalin's piano playing even if he was great as a pianist, I would have never been able to disassociate him for what he did. No one can separate the person from the artist. Its impossible. Evil always finds a way to appear even when performing music, the wicked cant shut out his wickedness when playing, and therefore he contaminates everything he does, like a dark spirit it envelopes its listeners and viewers.

For me an artist is a human being, not some kind of a game or a robot that I can separate according to my likes or dislikes. It just doesn’t work this way.



Are you comparing a young woman wearing a dress that stops where her thigh stops to a tyrannical dictator who is directly and indirectly responsible for the deaths of tens of millions of people? How can you say that those two acts are both of the same "evil"?

Wow. Anyhow.

She wore a short dress. yawn Can we talk about something interesting?

#1729787 - 08/09/11 11:36 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Damon]  
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Originally Posted by Damon


I think the preferred Latin phrase in now "malum mihi".



Perhaps you ought to express your views more explicitly. We got both extremes obviously covered.

Originally Posted by Damon
Originally Posted by Andromaque
You are flirting with racism


The only racism I saw was in Badorange's post.


Perhaps you should read his tirades again, if your stomach can take it.

Last edited by Andromaque; 08/09/11 11:37 PM.
#1729788 - 08/09/11 11:37 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul
Let her come out naked then, let her push it to the end, what's the problem?...

I said push the limits. I didn't say be ridiculous.

I guess the issue is that we see the "limits" differently.

#1729789 - 08/09/11 11:39 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Steve712]  
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Originally Posted by Steve712
Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by pno
I don't think there is anything "indecent" about her dress, although the style is more suitable for e.g. a poolside cocktail party than a concert.

And I completely agree with BB Player.

It doesn't matter whether you wrap yourself up like a Muslim, or are in black suit or in a bikini. If you are good you are good. If you are bad, you are bad. There is no such thing as "she plays well, but I hate her dress so she is bad".
Grow up people!


You're more then Welcome to enjoy Stalin's piano playing even if he was great as a pianist, I would have never been able to disassociate him for what he did. No one can separate the person from the artist. Its impossible. Evil always finds a way to appear even when performing music, the wicked cant shut out his wickedness when playing, and therefore he contaminates everything he does, like a dark spirit it envelopes its listeners and viewers.

For me an artist is a human being, not some kind of a game or a robot that I can separate according to my likes or dislikes. It just doesn’t work this way.



Are you comparing a young woman wearing a dress that stops where her thigh stops to a tyrannical dictator who is directly and indirectly responsible for the deaths of tens of millions of people? How can you say that those two acts are both of the same "evil"?

Wow. Anyhow.

She wore a short dress. yawn Can we talk about something interesting?


Its exactly the same, yes. Not in numbers or methods but in representation.

Stalin represents evil in the form of murders, deportations, etc...

She represented the porn industry and everything that is dark and wicked in today's world that celebrates profanity and the turning of women into men's playthings...

So I want her to be on the good side, not the bad.

Let her dress and behave like a lady, and she will represent goodness, and I will be more then happy to respect her.

#1729791 - 08/09/11 11:44 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Mark_C]  
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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Saul
Let her come out naked then, let her push it to the end, what's the problem?...

I said push the limits. I didn't say be ridiculous.

I guess the issue is that we see the "limits" differently.


I dont see any major difference between how she came out on stage and coming out totally naked.

What's the difference? 20 percent?

Some people get more aroused by watching women's legs...so what's the difference, you say private parts, I say there is no difference. One can say that she came out completely nude on stage. Yes 80 off is extremely close to nude.

You find this appropriate?

I'm sorry, I dont.

#1729792 - 08/09/11 11:46 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul


She represented the porn industry



I would really love to speak my mind here but I cannot do it in a way that will not grossly violate this forum's rules. In any way, you are doing yourself no good whatsoever by voicing your twisted opinion on this matter here and that's probably good enough..so nobody really has to put you in place, you are doing it to yourself by revealing what kind of a person you really are to everybody else on this forum.


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1729793 - 08/09/11 11:47 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Andromaque]  
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IMO, the dress conveys the image the wearer wants to project: I am young; I am trendy, I am sexy, I am fun, I want people to admire my body, I'm not afraid to buck tradition and I want to distract you. These are not the qualities I would want to project on stage. I'd want people to think: she's dignified, she's a lady, she's showing respect for the music, the audience and her teachers, she respects herself. Now I can concentrate on the lovely music she makes.


Best regards,

Deborah
#1729794 - 08/09/11 11:49 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul
She represented the porn industry and everything that is dark and wicked in today's world that celebrates profanity and the turning of women into men's playthings...

So I want her to be on the good side, not the bad.

Let her dress and behave like a lady, and she will represent goodness, and I will be more then happy to respect her.


Right ... meanwhile, in the twenty-first century, a forward thinking young man is frowning from the incoherence of his early twentieth century counterpart.

Really, though ... let's not talk about something so trivial.

#1729795 - 08/09/11 11:50 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Saul: I think it would be good to 'curb your enthusiasm' on this. smile

Some subjects seem to get you going a bit too much.....

#1729796 - 08/09/11 11:50 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
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Originally Posted by Saul

You're more then Welcome to enjoy Stalin's piano playing even if he was great as a pianist, I would have never been able to disassociate him for what he did.


Yeah, I probably would have passed on Stalin. I don't see any problem with you not seeing Ms. Wang or making decisions in this manner. I, however, don't liken her dress code to the murder of 20 million people. So if she plays in St. Louis, I'll get a ticket.

#1729798 - 08/09/11 11:51 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Saul]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,325
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Frozenicicles  Offline
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,325
Canada
Originally Posted by Saul
Originally Posted by liszt85
Originally Posted by Saul


for showing your body like that will get you only the bad kind of fans, those who will care only about your legs and not about your fingers.



The irony! You decided not to listen to her play because you couldn't focus on the music because of the dress.. you couldn't stop thinking about tramps and "hookers". You are the bad kind of fan that she should probably seek to avoid, and I see that she's already been successful. Seeing that dress, all I thought was "Wow, that's gorgeous and she's a good looking pianist", not "Wow, she looks like a wh**e". The latter is what you seem to be focused on.

Your intolerant and bordering-on-tyrannical stance here has lowered you so much in my esteem. Not that you'd care, just thought you should know.


Interesting philosophy you have there...'attack those who fight profanities'...

So I'm the bad guy for wanting women to have more dignity and self esteem and value then to cave in to the Porn Age poisonous fumes that contaminated our world?

Such a travesty of justice and a twisted view of things you have.

It is ridiculous when men judge women by what they wear and then say that they are defending their dignity and self esteem. When a woman wears something like what Yuja is wearing AND for the right reasons (she honestly feels good in it and she's only doing it for herself), then she has to have tremendous dignity and self esteem because there are often people like you in the side lines.

#1729799 - 08/09/11 11:53 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: liszt85]  
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Saul Offline
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Saul  Offline
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Posts: 743
Banned
Originally Posted by liszt85
Originally Posted by Saul


She represented the porn industry



I would really love to speak my mind here but I cannot do it in a way that will not grossly violate this forum's rules. In any way, you are doing yourself no good whatsoever by voicing your twisted opinion on this matter here and that's probably good enough..so nobody really has to put you in place, you are doing it to yourself by revealing what kind of a person you really are to everybody else on this forum.


What kind of a person I am?

1. I want women to be respected and celebrated for the right reasons.

2. I want to end the porn industry which is a pretty word for prostitution and profanity.

3. I want modesty and a humble spirit.

4. Equal rights for all.

5. Love between people , and complete harmony and unity.

If these things make me a bad person then I want to stay a 'bad' person...and I wish that all people in the world will be a 'bad' as me.

#1729800 - 08/09/11 11:53 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Mark_C]  
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liszt85 Offline
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liszt85  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 3,159
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Saul: I think it would be good to 'curb your enthusiasm' on this. smile

Some subjects seem to get you going a bit too much.....


So much that one poster even talked about "religious intolerance" in response to Saul when there has been no question about religion here at all. Which is to reiterate my point about how perceptions about different parts of the world develop as a result of people's behaviors on an international forum (whether online or not).


Current:
Beethoven: Sonata Op.31, No.2 ("Tempest")
Debussy: Danseuses de Delphes (Prelude 1, Book 1)
Next in line:
Chopin: Ballade No. 1 in G minor, Op.23
Debussy: Le vent dans la plaine (Prelude 3, Book 1)
Debussy: Les sons et les parfums tournent dans l'air du soir (Prelude 4, Book 1)
#1729801 - 08/09/11 11:56 PM Re: Yuja Wang's dress gets even more attention [Re: Steve712]  
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Posts: 743
Saul Offline
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Saul  Offline
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Posts: 743
Banned
Originally Posted by Steve712
Originally Posted by Saul
She represented the porn industry and everything that is dark and wicked in today's world that celebrates profanity and the turning of women into men's playthings...

So I want her to be on the good side, not the bad.

Let her dress and behave like a lady, and she will represent goodness, and I will be more then happy to respect her.


Right ... meanwhile, in the twenty-first century, a forward thinking young man is frowning from the incoherence of his early twentieth century counterpart.

Really, though ... let's not talk about something so trivial.


What are you talking about, it would be a true delight if women and men wore and behave so respectfully as they did some 200/300 years ago.

Refine spirit, manners, dignity, self esteem, respect for the elders and women, they were light years ahead of us.

Last edited by Saul; 08/09/11 11:57 PM.
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