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We've owned several synths including the Yamaha FS1R, AN1x, Motif ES rack; Korg Wavestation SR, and Waldorf MicroQ. The big disappointment for me in all the ones that use samples has been the low quality of said samples, so SN in that role would be very welcome.

I have owned a bunch of synths too. SN alone isn't going to guarantee a good sound. Listen to the EPs and guitars.

The only area where I found the JP to be exceptional was the trumpet and violin patch and the articulations associated with those patches. Nevertheless, it definitely didn't get me anywhere close to wow.

EPs are a matter of taste it seems, the SN ones in the NX sound pretty good to me (but I'm definitely not an EP connoisseur). Honestly, I'll take almost anything non-looped over almost anything looped as I find looping a total sound killer. YMMV.

You rarely hear about EP guys gushing about Roland EPs. They are ok, but when you want the kind of character you hear in 70s recordings, I don't think the SN EPs cut it. They sound more like they come from the 80s. I know things are always subjective, but when it comes to Roland EPs, I highly doubt they would be the choice of many EP focused guys.

I'm not sure if SN means the same thing for every instrument. I'm assuming it doesn't encompass articulations for the piano and EP sounds. I'm not sure if the absence of looping is the key defining characteristic of the SuperNatural term. What is a a Supernatural synth sound? Seems like an oxymoron.

I'll be going to the clinic in a few hours. My GC rep called me and offered me a very good price on one to persuade me to take one home after the clinic. I'm not sure that will happen, but depending on what I find out about the synth section, it is a possibility.

I met Scott Tibbs of Roland and he took the time to answer all of my questions. Really great guy.

I'll post a follow up and tell you what he told me about the SN label, the vision of Roland's founder and several other interesting topics.

For now I have to set up the Jupiter.

Too funny!

Well it obviously *wowed* you to some extent. If you decide to sell it let me know.

And of course congrats. You're now the man of many keyboards.

Funny I know. I really didn't think I was going to go in and walk out with one, but I will be the first to admit my initial in store impressions were off base.

The pianos and EPs did not wow me. In fact when Scott played solo piano I kind of understood why Roland pianos don't sound right live. Several audience members were commenting that the pianos sounded muted. I definitely prefer the Kronos for those two key areas but do think the SN pianos sound good in recordings and at the home.

Other acoustic instruments like the trumpet and violin are by far the best I have heard, with the SN articulations adding much needed expression to these sounds. They introduced this on the V synth but it is really fully developed on the Jupiter.

The synth section is what really interested me, and it was out of this world.

The board is also set up ideally for live playing.

I'm trying to figure out which board I don't want, but they each serve such a different purpose so I'm kind of stumped. Kronos/Jupiter hybrid would be a perfect keyboard. The V-synth is really unique in functionality and I have had 2 Viruses. I take the Virus with me most of the time so I think I just need to make sure I don't buy another board and I'll be fine.

I was told that the Jupiter 80 is the most important product for the founder of Roland. It is the culmination of his original vision for Roland. I definitely see the vision in the Jupiter 80. I'm not sure if it will be a commercial success, but it is really a unique and compelling product once you get to understand what its about.

But most importantly, has Scott Tibbs still got his tragic ponytail?

Yes. He looks exactly as he does in the YouTube videos.

I asked Scott specifically about the SuperNatural term and what it meant. Depending on the sound it can mean different things. My interpretation of Scott's answer is that it means they have identified and incorporated the elements of a sound that make it natural. Achieving natural sound through synthesis is the core of Ikutaro Kakehashi's vision.

The original Jupiter and today's Jupiter were both designed with the goal of emulating acoustic sounds through synthesis. The original Jupiter had much less success at doing that, but it sounded great nonetheless and people stopped thinking about it as an emulator. The SuperNatural term reflects that original and persisting goal of recreating natural sounds through synthesis.

For any given sound, SN means they have captured the natural sound of the instrument by focusing on the key elements that they believe are critical to producing a natural sound. Almost all of it is achieved through modeling. Scott indicated only the attack had sample elements. In all cases no velocity switching seems to be highlighted. For piano no looping in the decay is also key.

For other acoustic sounds like the violin, trumpet, etc. SN is focusing more on the natural articulation of the instruments, as that is the element that brings a more natural sound to those voices. Having experience with the articulations in the V-synth, I was very interested in this area. They greatly expanded the articulations, and there is no doubt this element makes a huge difference in the ability to use those sounds in an expressive way.

Finally, with the SN synth sounds, it is also referring to the articulations that you can incorporate, but it is really just referring to how much more expressive the new synth engine is and the quality of the new sounds. I'm not sure if SN really makes sense with the synths, but I can confirm that the quality of the synth sounds on the Jupiter are amazing and the primary reason I bought it.

Interesting stuff, thanks Hideki.

So in terms of SN piano sounds, the attack is sampled, and the decay is modelled.

Sounds good to me!

Cheers,
James
x

SN plus articulations seems like a killer combo!

I really just want one very well done example of each standard string, brass, woodwind, etc. instrument in a synth like this: one trumpet (plus maybe a muted version), one harp, one violin, one nylon guitar, etc. Maybe two pianos and two harpsichords.

Are the drums SN?


IMO, synths have been in the doldrums for quite a while now. Romplers and virtual analog bore me absolutely to tears. If I hear another low-pass filtered pulse waveform I'm going to hurl. I blame the retro movement.

Keyboards bore me too. New, innovative controllers are what I'd really like to see, but no large manufacturer will go there as they think the profit margins are too small. At this point we're lucky to even have the D-Beam to flail at at I suppose.

Up all night playing the Jupiter. It is a pretty incredible board.

When it comes to the critical area of pianos and EPs the Kronos is king in my book. The SN pianos are really nice too, but the Kronos pianos sound more organic. EPs are no contest, especially because editing of the EPs on the Jupiter is strangely limited.

I have to say in the other area of acoustic instruments the Kronos does not sound so great when played next to the Jupiter. From a player's perspective the addition of all the articulations and the quality of the sounds make a for a very different experience.

The synth section is the area that I'm sure will be of greatest debate, but it is the area that most impressed me. I can see why Scott thinks it is the best digital synth ever.

Honestly, I don't think I've ever had as much fun in the initial hours of owning a keyboard. Although a singular board would be great, I think the Kronos and Jupiter actually make quite the perfect pair.

On a sided note, I wish the Kronos was built with the quality of the Jupiter. I know it would increase the cost significantly, but having the two side by side is a pretty stark contrast in materials and construction.

This has long been my supposition. Certainly the first thing I would try were I designing a sampled/modeled digital piano.

Dewster,

Apparently everything is SN.

For me, the Virus is a staple and really a synth that is great for learning about synthesis. It can take a lifetime to fully understand. The V-synth GT is one of the truly revolutionary synths and offers things no other synth does. The time pad was a great addition and Variphrase is a great sampling tool. Articulations were nicely introduced as well.

The Jupiter really takes sound quality and articuations of synth sounds to a new level. The massive layering and blending capabilities also make for the thickest sounds I have ever heard. The opening real time performance of the Tron theme was really impressive, even for the old guys.

I'll take that as a "Wow!"

Double wow. I'll eat my words twice on this one.

The manuals are now up:
http://www.roland.com/products/en/_support/om.cfm?PRODUCT=JUPITER-80

Looking at the Owner's Manual and Parameter Guide, I don't see a tone list - strange.

If you feel like providing a DPBSD MP3, I'd gladly analyze the harpsichord voice - provided there is one and provided it doesn't sound too synthy.

I think the tone list is on one of the disks. I'll look for it.

Haven't found a harpsichord. Plenty of clavs, pianos and EPs. I don't need one but strange if it isn't here. I'll keep looking.