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Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval #1691936
06/07/11 11:09 AM
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I'm at a loss for one. Ideally the first two notes a desceding minor 7th, but anywhere distinct and repetitive within the piece would be fine too. This is the only interval that I cannot find a famous piece or song for. Anyone knows of one?

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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1691952
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Originally Posted by MathTeacher
I'm at a loss for one. Ideally the first two notes a desceding minor 7th, but anywhere distinct and repetitive within the piece would be fine too. This is the only interval that I cannot find a famous piece or song for. Anyone knows of one?


I can think of an ascending minor 7th: "Somewhere" from Westside Story ("There's a place for us").

Now this is going to bug me all day...


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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1691955
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The first Google response took me to a page that said:

The descending minor seventh is usually Herbie Hancock’s Watermelon Man, or the old symphony composition An American in Paris.

I'm listening to An American in Paris right now though, and I haven't heard the place yet.

Here's the page where I found this: http://blog.audiojungle.net/resourc...ecting-intervals-with-song-associations/

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1691982
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As I remember, Elgar liked to use minor 7th leaps often in his work (descending and ascending). Some of his more familiar works probably would have an instance that could stick in the head fairly easily.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1691986
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I never realized how unusual this is till I tried to come up with an example, and couldn't.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692002
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I was practicing Chopin's first impromptu earlier and the music is on the stand. Are there not one or two descending minor 7ths in bar 23 onwards in the RH? Or is my theory up the shoot?

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: sandalholme] #1692007
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Originally Posted by sandalholme
I was practicing Chopin's first impromptu earlier and the music is on the stand. Are there not one or two descending minor 7ths in bar 23 onwards in the RH? Or is my theory up the shoot?

You're right! And while that's not really a melody in the sense of what I think we were looking for, it might be about as close as we're going to get. smile

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692012
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Is this just a phenomenon with the minor 7th? Are there famous melodies starting with a descending major 7th? Or a descending minor 9th? Nothing comes to mind for any of these now.

-J


Beethoven op.110, Chopin op.27/2, Liszt Vallée d'Obermann
Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692015
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In the bridge passage of the song "The Heather on the Hill" from Lerner and Loew's Brigadoon there is a descending interval C-sharp to E-flat, on the (underlined) words : "... other springs as full and fair...." At this point the song is in C major.

The opening of "Something Wonderful" from Rodger and Hammerstein's The King and I starts with a descending major seventh : C-sharp to D-sharp on the (underlined) words "He will not always say ..."

In Mahler's song "Ich atmet' einen linden Duft," there is a phrase on the words "der Lin - den duft in which the under lined word is notated B (above middle C), A, B (below middle C); another descending seventh, A to B.

I don't know whether you would consider the following since it constitutes the last note of one phrase and the beginning of the next :
The famous clarinet theme from the third movement of Rachmaninoff's second symphony ends the first phrase on A, begins the next phrase on B; ends that phrase on G, begins the next phrase on A. Each of those intervals between the end of one phrase and the beginning of the next is a minor seventh.

Are those not all descending minor sevenths?

Regards,

Last edited by BruceD; 06/07/11 02:09 PM. Reason: Addition

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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692019
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well, for descending major 7th there's mendelssohn's midsummer night dream. (i remember the melody, not sure about the actual work) i just happen to know this, randomly.

i can't imagine minor 7th being too uncommon, since it's just the outer notes of a dominant chord. but hey, i can't think of any example either, although i'm pretty bad at these things.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692036
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Tchaikovsky's almost unbearably sad song None But the Lonely Heart:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngI4kPhbxc4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQKP6RWGme8

Stephen Hough made a beautiful solo piano transcription of this piece. Please PM me with your email address if you're interested in it.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 06/07/11 02:31 PM.
Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Lingyis] #1692040
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Originally Posted by Lingyis
....i can't imagine minor 7th being too uncommon, since it's just the outer notes of a dominant chord. but hey, i can't think of any example either....

And that's just it -- the interval wouldn't seem to be uncommon, but it looks like it is.

The difference with things like descending major 7th's and descending minor 9th's is that it's no surprise that they're uncommon.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MarkH] #1692042
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Originally Posted by MarkH
The first Google response took me to a page that said:

The descending minor seventh is usually Herbie Hancock’s Watermelon Man, or the old symphony composition An American in Paris.

I'm listening to An American in Paris right now though, and I haven't heard the place yet.

Here's the page where I found this: http://blog.audiojungle.net/resourc...ecting-intervals-with-song-associations/


The "American in Paris" interval is at the very beginning of the piece, though there is a half-step grace-note preceding. But this is a good example, I think.


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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692051
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I can think of a really good example with ascending 7ths.... the whole piece is flooded with them actually. Any guesses?



"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."
Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692054
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Let's put this into a harmonic context : Think of a dominant seventh or ninth* chord on G, with melody notes of A down to B, resolving to a tonic chord on C with the melody note of C. There must be dozens of songs that end with that sequence. Does that "ring any bells"?

*Thanks, Mark_C!

Regards,

Last edited by BruceD; 06/07/11 02:17 PM. Reason: See next post

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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: BruceD] #1692063
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Actually that might be a dominant 9th smile depending on whether the "A" already has the dominant -- but that's a great hint.

Even though I'm not exactly coming up with anything. smile

It does indeed feel familiar.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Pogorelich.] #1692070
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Originally Posted by Pogorelich.
I can think of a really good example with ascending 7ths.... the whole piece is flooded with them actually. Any guesses?


10/10? even if those aren't really melodies...

there are some descending 7ths in 25/1.

i should make it a habit to pay attention to intervals a bit more, seems like a good exercise.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692086
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Earmaster site

http://www.earmaster.com/intervalsongs/

Lists the following:

Watermelon man
An American in Paris (Gershwin)
Lady Jane; Chorus (Rolling Stones)

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: sandalholme] #1692100
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Originally Posted by sandalholme
I was practicing Chopin's first impromptu earlier and the music is on the stand. Are there not one or two descending minor 7ths in bar 23 onwards in the RH? Or is my theory up the shoot?


Ah yes. I've played this before too. Though it doesn't stand out in the piece, this might be the best example for me.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692103
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Chopin nocturne op 37 no 2


Sorry for my English, I know it sucks, but I'm trying to improve.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692176
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Don't mind me; I talk too much and know too little.

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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692178
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Chopin again, the B-flat minor Mazurka Op. 24/4 has a recurring descending minor seventh. It's not really a melody, but it's a striking enough passage that it's what most people remember of the piece having heard it.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Lingyis] #1692210
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Originally Posted by Lingyis
Originally Posted by Pogorelich.
I can think of a really good example with ascending 7ths.... the whole piece is flooded with them actually. Any guesses?


10/10? even if those aren't really melodies...

there are some descending 7ths in 25/1.

i should make it a habit to pay attention to intervals a bit more, seems like a good exercise.


Not Chopin



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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: MathTeacher] #1692239
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If you need to sing a minor 7th it may be easier to think down an octave and up a step, than to recall a melody.

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: jeffreyjones] #1692248
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Originally Posted by jeffreyjones
Chopin again, the B-flat minor Mazurka Op. 24/4 has a recurring descending minor seventh. It's not really a melody, but it's a striking enough passage that it's what most people remember of the piece having heard it.

Great get!!! thumb
I want to smack myself on the head for not thinking of it, because it's one of my favorite pieces. And BTW I think it's at least real close to being 'really a melody.'

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Ferdinand] #1692273
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Originally Posted by Ferdinand
If you need to sing a minor 7th it may be easier to think down an octave and up a step, than to recall a melody.


This. Most definitely. In my choir, we call it the "Bass trick", hehe. Basses sometimes have to do octave leaps, so we just think up a step or a third (or whatever the short interval is), instead of down the sixth or seventh...

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: BruceD] #1692281
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Originally Posted by BruceD
Let's put this into a harmonic context : Think of a dominant seventh or ninth* chord on G, with melody notes of A down to B, resolving to a tonic chord on C with the melody note of C. There must be dozens of songs that end with that sequence. Does that "ring any bells"?

*Thanks, Mark_C!

Regards,


Here is one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xY3gZMQpFOs

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Ferdinand] #1692297
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Originally Posted by Ferdinand

Good one!

And it seems to me some old TV commercial jingle ended that way too.....can't come up with exactly what. I think it was either some laundry product or toilet paper. ha

(edit) I got it -- it was COFFEE. The final lyric was "So unbeatable....it's reheatable." smile

Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: pianoloverus] #1692301
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Tchaikovsky's almost unbearably sad song None But the Lonely Heart:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ngI4kPhbxc4
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQKP6RWGme8


Good one! "None But the Lonely Heart" is perfect for remembering the interval.

But I didn't realize until reading this thread what a rare gesture it was to begin a piece (or a theme) with a desc. minor 7th.

Edited to say: lol, I didn't realize I was parroting Mark C's exclamation.

Last edited by scherzetto; 06/08/11 07:54 PM.

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Re: Name a famous piece with a descending minor 7th interval [Re: Orange Soda King] #1692319
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Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
Originally Posted by Ferdinand
If you need to sing a minor 7th it may be easier to think down an octave and up a step, than to recall a melody.

This. Most definitely. In my choir, we call it the "Bass trick", hehe.


I've been a member of several choirs, and this idea is completely new to me. "Bass trick"???

One choir director made us sing solfege intervals to warm up. Minor 7th would be "Do to Re" (descending).


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