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#1641887 - 03/15/11 11:20 PM Next gig bag will not have wheels  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 737
Chris G Offline
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Chris G  Offline
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Portland, Oregon
I have a soft sided case with wheel for my CP-33, the brand is GigSkinz. I've had it about a year and a half and it gets used a couple of times a month on average. Already both wheels have fallen off and it seems to be falling apart in other ways so I'm ready for a new bag already. While researching which bag to buy to replace it I noticed that the soft sided wheeled cases weigh about 15 pounds more than the gig bag without wheels, which is a lot of extra weight. The case with wheels probably has more padding but that is needed because when rolled on a rough surface you need padding. Here is an example of two such bags.

http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4498&CatalogID=9178
http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4482&CatalogID=9299


Since my keyboard lives upstairs I have to take it up and down one flight of stairs to take it in and out of the house which is the worst aspect of carrying it around. If I can save 15 pounds of weight by losing the wheels then it will be easier to climb those stairs and I won't need the wheels so much since I will be able to carry it easier.

Has anyone else come to the conclusion that wheels on soft cases are more trouble than they are worth?

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#1641955 - 03/16/11 01:06 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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ChrisA Offline
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ChrisA  Offline
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Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted by Chris G
I have a soft sided case with wheel for my CP-33, the brand is GigSkinz. I've had it about a year and a half and it gets used a couple of times a month on average. Already both wheels have fallen off and it seems to be falling apart in other ways so I'm ready for a new bag already. While researching which bag to buy to replace it I noticed that the soft sided wheeled cases weigh about 15 pounds more than the gig bag without wheels, which is a lot of extra weight. The case with wheels probably has more padding but that is needed because when rolled on a rough surface you need padding. Here is an example of two such bags.

http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4498&CatalogID=9178
http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4482&CatalogID=9299


Since my keyboard lives upstairs I have to take it up and down one flight of stairs to take it in and out of the house which is the worst aspect of carrying it around. If I can save 15 pounds of weight by losing the wheels then it will be easier to climb those stairs and I won't need the wheels so much since I will be able to carry it easier.

Has anyone else come to the conclusion that wheels on soft cases are more trouble than they are worth?


You can buy a folding dolly, then when you need the wheels bungee the case to the dolly. When wheels are not needed leave the dolly and have a lighter case. Another modular setup I have is you get the lightest softcase yu can and then I built a wooden road case with not padding, just a wooden box that you place the soft case inside. So the instrument goes in the gig bag, the bag in the box and the box on the fold up dolly. You can use as much of that setup as you need, maybe just the bag. Fold up dollies are have larger diametr wheels than wheeled cases so that work on stairs and curbs

I don't move my P155 but I have a case for my older 76 key Roland and guitars. I also move my scuba nd underwater camera gear. I live close to the ocean so it is just a short ride in the back of a pickup truck but I use the same folding dolly with the pelican cases

#1641962 - 03/16/11 01:31 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: ChrisA]  
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Chris G Offline
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Chris G  Offline
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Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted by ChrisA
Originally Posted by Chris G
I have a soft sided case with wheel for my CP-33, the brand is GigSkinz. I've had it about a year and a half and it gets used a couple of times a month on average. Already both wheels have fallen off and it seems to be falling apart in other ways so I'm ready for a new bag already. While researching which bag to buy to replace it I noticed that the soft sided wheeled cases weigh about 15 pounds more than the gig bag without wheels, which is a lot of extra weight. The case with wheels probably has more padding but that is needed because when rolled on a rough surface you need padding. Here is an example of two such bags.

http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4498&CatalogID=9178
http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...s&CategoryID=4482&CatalogID=9299


Since my keyboard lives upstairs I have to take it up and down one flight of stairs to take it in and out of the house which is the worst aspect of carrying it around. If I can save 15 pounds of weight by losing the wheels then it will be easier to climb those stairs and I won't need the wheels so much since I will be able to carry it easier.

Has anyone else come to the conclusion that wheels on soft cases are more trouble than they are worth?


You can buy a folding dolly, then when you need the wheels bungee the case to the dolly. When wheels are not needed leave the dolly and have a lighter case. Another modular setup I have is you get the lightest softcase yu can and then I built a wooden road case with not padding, just a wooden box that you place the soft case inside. So the instrument goes in the gig bag, the bag in the box and the box on the fold up dolly. You can use as much of that setup as you need, maybe just the bag. Fold up dollies are have larger diameter wheels than wheeled cases so that work on stairs and curbs

I don't move my P155 but I have a case for my older 76 key Roland and guitars. I also move my scuba nd underwater camera gear. I live close to the ocean so it is just a short ride in the back of a pickup truck but I use the same folding dolly with the pelican cases


The dolly sounds like a good idea - I could use bungee cords to hold the keyboard in place. My only concern would be that the keyboard could slip off when going over a curb.

#1642012 - 03/16/11 04:47 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
Joined: Jul 2004
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Dave Horne Offline
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Dave Horne  Offline
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Vught, The Netherlands
I had a flight case made for my since sold P250 (which is the same size as the CP300). That flight case has small wheels at one end which come in handy when moving it in my car. I use a hand truck most of the time but those small wheels help to move it in places where you can't use a hand truck.

Soft cases are an accident waiting to happen. You'll spend much more for a flight case but if you do it right, you'll never have to buy another. I use spacers to take up the extra space afforded by the slimmer CP5. My flight case should outlive me.




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#1642157 - 03/16/11 11:15 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Dave Horne]  
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Chris G Offline
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Chris G  Offline
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Portland, Oregon
Originally Posted by Dave Horne
I had a flight case made for my since sold P250 (which is the same size as the CP300). That flight case has small wheels at one end which come in handy when moving it in my car. I use a hand truck most of the time but those small wheels help to move it in places where you can't use a hand truck.

Soft cases are an accident waiting to happen. You'll spend much more for a flight case but if you do it right, you'll never have to buy another. I use spacers to take up the extra space afforded by the slimmer CP5. My flight case should outlive me.


I can see your point there. Unfortunately the combined weight of keyboard and hard case is more than I can comfortably carry, I'm still in the process of recovering from a shoulder problem I had last year.

#1642167 - 03/16/11 11:31 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
Joined: Jul 2004
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Dave Horne Offline
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Dave Horne  Offline
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Vught, The Netherlands
Chris, sorry to hear of your shoulder problem. I moved my equipment last week and somehow messed up my knee in the process. It's not fun getting older ... but it still beats the alternative.




website | mp3 files | Yamaha AvantGrand N3 | Roland RD 2000 | Sennheiser HD 598 headphones
#1642185 - 03/16/11 12:03 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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ChrisA Offline
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ChrisA  Offline
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Redondo Beach, California
Quote

I can see your point there. Unfortunately the combined weight of keyboard and hard case is more than I can comfortably carry, I'm still in the process of recovering from a shoulder problem I had last year.


I agree the that, Flight cases could last forever. I worked at a place where we had a couple hundred cases made for a customer. Some of them had four wheels and as you'd guess now and then one might roll off a loading dock with $20K worth of equipment inside. They did just fine. But the weight is killer and so is the cost.

Other alternatives to flight cases are:

I've seen a style of case that is made of rigid foam covered with cloth. The case has the appearance of a hard case but the weight of a gig bag. You might look for one of those. It's basically a large chuck of styrofoam with covering

If you can it is not hard to build a case. It takes me a few hours and you get exactly what you want. I use a light wood frame and 3/16 ply sheet for the sides and the weight is not much.

#1642192 - 03/16/11 12:14 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
Joined: Jul 2004
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Dave Horne Offline
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Dave Horne  Offline
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Vught, The Netherlands
When I had my case made (for my then P250), I chose thin material for the large flat sections since the piano itself was very flat and rigid. (It could have have been 3/16 for all I know.)

I personally recommend having cases custom made. I had a discussion with the guy who made mine and was forced to think about options that I never would have thought of. Some guys like to have the keyboard stay permanently in the bottom section and have the top section not being hinged. I prefer not having the case always in front of me while I play but that's an option I never would have thought of.

I'll see kids moving their equipment in the original cardboard box and I just shake my head.




website | mp3 files | Yamaha AvantGrand N3 | Roland RD 2000 | Sennheiser HD 598 headphones
#1642461 - 03/16/11 07:48 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Dave Horne]  
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 90
andi85 Offline
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Germany
Originally Posted by Dave Horne
Soft cases are an accident waiting to happen. You'll spend much more for a flight case but if you do it right, you'll never have to buy another.

That's true, however, I've been reconsidering the strong pro-case position that I had for pretty much all the time I've played keyboards live.

If you're on your own, flight cases can be a pain to move, literally – you guys all know what I mean. Managing stairs or longer distances is really tough.
On one of the last gigs with my trusty old Roland RD-150 I couldn't get close to the location I was supposed to play and I wondered if I was really doing the board a favor by packing it nicely in its custom flight case first but then rattling it over uneven surfaces on a warehouse trolley because I couldn't carry the loaded case all the way to the "stage". Wouldn't it be better for me (and the board) to put it into a gig bag, take good care and simply carry it where it's supposed to be?

So on the same day I ordered a gig bag for my Roland and I did so for my new CP-5, although I'll get a flight case for it as soon as I can afford it. I might even get a gig bag for carrying my Nord C1 to rehearsals and leave the case where it is. I don't see too much harm coming if it's alone sitting in my car – but I see a lot of harm coming to my back if I haul it in its case over three flights of stairs :-)

If you're travelling with others, it's a different story, though. I wouldn't want to have anything but a case for that purpose. If it's heavy, that's ok, you have somebody to help. If you're alone and careful, a decent gig bag might do the job without wearing out your back.

Last edited by andi85; 03/16/11 07:54 PM.

Best

Andreas
#1642646 - 03/17/11 02:21 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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jazzwee Offline
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So. California
I just bought a gator case with wheels. I hope it survives the light duty I expect it to have. This discussion has me worried now.

The case is very light and there are metal supports inside. I'm not expecting any stairs but I really don't want to be carrying anything.


Pianoclues.com for Beginners
My Jazz Blog
Hamburg Steinway O, Nord Electro 4 HP

#1643292 - 03/18/11 12:30 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: jazzwee]  
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Jazzwee, please report back to this thread on your experience with the wheeled Gator bag. That will help me in my search for whatever best saves my back and my FP-7F.

#1643364 - 03/18/11 05:13 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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Aidan Offline
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UK
The problem I've found with a dolly or truck solution is that I regularly come up against steps. And then you've either got to lift the whole thing (now much heavier and less secure than a one-piece unit) or take the keyboard case off and then you've got two things to get up the steps.

Wheeled soft cases are slightly heavier but they do have the advantage of being adaptable to different surfaces and manageable by one person. Even with a 25kg CP5 in my Gator case, I was able to lift and wheel it. Loading in/out, I used the flat platform of my car's boot (trunk) as a pivot to lift it in and out safely without ever endangering my spine.

I'm currently wheeling the NP around in a 76-key Gator I usually use for my Hammond while awaiting delivery of the Nord bag. Jazzwee, the Gator cases are OK but thinly padded so you need to be extra careful moving them around. I've experienced one or two minor dings on keyboards previously carried in them.

ChrisG, the Gigskinz cases look impressive but I think the quality is very questionable. I had an 88-note one on which the zip broke about three weeks into ownership. I'm not surprised the wheels came off yours smile

If I was moving the Nord around in any other circumstances than having it in the back of my own car and wheeling it in personally, I would probably go for one of the SKB plastic cases. If flying, an ATA-rated flightcase is the only sensible choice.


Live: Casio PX-5S | Hammond SK1
Studio: Yamaha CP4 | Hammond SK2 | Kurzweil PC361 | Moog Sub 37
#1643489 - 03/18/11 10:53 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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I have Roland FP-4 and I bought lightweight unit to make it light, so buying a hard case for it would destroy the biggest advantage.
Always be careful with straps for carrying on your arm, seam can be too weak - I had a little accident with my lighter, 12kg unit. So I ordered custom soft case with strong straps and pocket dimensions I wanted (cost was about 100$). It looks similar to this one (same manufacturer), but with arm strap:
[Linked Image]

It arrived today, and will be comfortable enough to move by bus, which occasionally happens to me smile
Hard case is good when you can afford it, and you don't mind asking others for help. Anyway, for me using wooden hard case with a lot of metal elements is so Middle Ages-like... like there was no modern lightweight material invented. I think about something like this one http://www.gatorcases.com/Default.a...&CategoryID=4434&CatalogID=11545 , but not so heavy - wisely designed, made from kind of modern plastic-like something, casted in shape that makes it impossible to crush.


Roland FP-4
#1643498 - 03/18/11 11:15 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: kiedysktos.]  
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andi85 Offline
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Looks like a nice soft case you got there!
Who is the manufacturer?

Thanks!
Andreas


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Andreas
#1643538 - 03/18/11 12:25 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: andi85]  
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Hey, folks. For those of us with slim boards like the FP-4, I've found that carrying the case under my arm works well. I've even added an extra cloth loop at the bottom of the bag to help. So if I'm carrying the bag on my right side, my right hand goes around the bag and holds the new bottom strap, supporting most of the weight, and my left hand holds the top strap. Carrying the board this way has helped my arms and shoulders immensely.


Yamaha CP4, Kawai CA93
#1643659 - 03/18/11 05:10 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: kiedysktos.]  
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Chris G Offline
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kiedysktos, I like the idea of a custom made soft case. I also would be interested in knowing who you ordered yours from.

#1643851 - 03/18/11 11:38 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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I'm interested in the pros and cons of various types of cases because I am a new keyboard owner (FP4), and because I have repetitive strain injuries, which means that I can only carry cases in certain ways.

One thing I know from carrying guitars and sitars around for many years is that - for me at least - I prefer to have some kind of strap that serves two functions: (1) the strap loops around the case at each end (to keep the case closed in the event of the locks / clasps / hinges / zips popping open), and (2) using this kind of structure, and if the strap is long and wide enough (and padded), one can anchor the keyboard under one arm, while the weight is supported by putting the strap across the body, over the opposite shoulder.

I have been interested by the Kaces case mentioned in other threads here, but the 17lbs. weight almost seems to defeat the objective for me (the case in point has wheels)
Kaces cases

Last edited by drutgat; 03/18/11 11:40 PM.

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#1644067 - 03/19/11 12:33 PM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: Chris G]  
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kiedysktos. Offline
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I ordered mine from Canto, company from Poland. http://www.canto.pl/product_55_pl.html Find similar one in your country. Most soft bags look very cheap...


If you order, there are two element there are very important in durability:

Strap seam - there should be bigger overlap, and more seam.
[Linked Image]


Ring, where the strap will be pinned up - it is attached by material loop, and if the overlap is too small, it can be picked out by the weight of instrument; it happened to my older board in ab old soft case.
[Linked Image]

In mine custom case I have 10cm (4 inches) overlap in those elements, and there is a "X" shape seam over it; it makes it 100% safe.


Roland FP-4
#1644584 - 03/20/11 09:23 AM Re: Next gig bag will not have wheels [Re: drutgat]  
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Walt Brooks Offline
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New England
drutgat

I have a Kases case that I use to transport my CP33 and have been quite satisfied with it. For most moving, I just wrap both arms around the whole thing and carry it. I use the wheels for light duty moving, like rolling the unit up into the back of the car (I fold down the back seat and put the DP in through the trunk) -- which is very handy. I move the CP33 a couple of times a month, and its always under my control. This is not a solution I would recommend if there were other people moving my equipment (its been a long time since I needed "roadies") - in that instance I agree with Dave Horne -- go with a flight case. As has been noted elsewhere in PW, the CP33 is reasonably light, and with the Kases its well within my comfort zone to haul around. Ive used it this way for a couple of years, and both the CP33 and the case look brand new. Hope that's a help.

Walt Brooks




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