Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!


SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Modern Piano Moving
Modern Piano Moving
(ad)
Virtual Sheet Music
Download Sheet Music Instantly
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Sheet Music...
(125ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Spring 2017
(ad)
Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restorations and sales
Who's Online Now
103 registered members (Albunea, Alexander Borro, Almaviva, amad23, Adam S., anotherscott, 25 invisible), 2,063 guests, and 13 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 2 1 2
#1629536 - 02/27/11 09:25 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Kawai James  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Hamamatsu, Japan
Toh-may-toh, toh-mah-toh...

James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
(ad) ROLAND

Click Here

#1629716 - 02/28/11 05:14 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,683
FogVilleLad Offline
4000 Post Club Member
FogVilleLad  Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,683
San Francisco
Originally Posted by craig1999871
[quote=MacMacMac]So what exactly is meant by "layer"?
Timbre varies with volume, so the sound is more realistic.

#1629723 - 02/28/11 05:47 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 796
Macy Offline
500 Post Club Member
Macy  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 796
Originally Posted by craig1999871
Another question(if I did buy the mp10) I notice it has 3 layers of piano sounds. Im guessing that is dynamic as in p f ff. Would I be able to get a vst that does 4 or 5 when available? or is it a sensor thing that is on the piano that only looks for 3 velocity layers.


Most DP keyboards will produce all (or most) MIDI velocity levels from 0-127. Some actually don't produce levels much above 105-110, but it's easy to expand the range all the way to 127 in the computer that runs your virtual piano software. The number of actual sample levels captured (recorded) from an acoustic piano varies from as few as 3 in a DP to many more in virtual piano software (Ivory II has 18 captured levels for instance). DPs and virtual pianos will interpolate between the captured levels for the entire range of 0-127 velocity levels. The advantage of capturing more sample levels from the acoustic piano is the ability reproduce the acoustic's wide timbre range (as opposed to only volume changes) as the keys are struck at different velocities.

You said above that "my priorities are to have the best possible acoustic grand sound and to have the best possible touch feel to that of a real piano." IMO, you will never achieve your sound priorities with a DP. That requires many more captured sampling layers than normally found in DP's. It also requires sustain (damper pedal) resonance, sympathetic string resonance, release samples, and half pedaling capabilities that are typically either not included or not done particularly well in DPs.

I would be willing to bet that whatever DP you buy it will not sound nearly as good to you 30 days after you buy it when you've had the time and experience with it to discover it's limitations emulating an acoustic piano. (You will never be perfectly happy with virtual piano software either, but it's a lot less expensive to spend $100-$300 to upgrade, or acquire a selection of virtual piano software for different musical preferences, than buy new DP's). So my bottom line recommendation is to buy a DP keyboard for the touch you like (and be sure you get a proportional damper pedal) and any fun features you might like to fool around with, but pretty much ignore its built in piano sounds. Unless you spend considerable money for a DP, you can also ignore its built-in speakers and amplifiers because they also won't satisfy your stated goal. You'll have to provide a separate sound system if you want to approach the sound of an acoustic piano. Then get some first-class virtual piano software and you should be in pretty good shape to meet your goals.

Just my opinion, but it works for me.






Macy

CVP-409GP, Garritan CFX, Vintage D, Ivory II GP's & American Concert D, Pianoteq, True Keys American D, Ravenscroft 275, Garritan Authorized Steinway, Alicia's Keys, EWQL Pianos, MainStage, iPad Pro/forScore/PageFlip Cicada, Custom Mac MIDI/Audio Software Design, Macs Everywhere
#1629743 - 02/28/11 07:41 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
craig son of berg Offline
Full Member
craig son of berg  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
WPB, FL, US of A
Thanks macy. I know I'm tired of my acoustic piano. Thanks for all your detailed help.


play that one again sam
(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#1629763 - 02/28/11 08:34 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: FogVilleLad]  
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,169
MacMacMac Offline
5000 Post Club Member
MacMacMac  Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 5,169
North Carolina
Originally Posted by FogVilleLad
Originally Posted by craig1999871
[quote=MacMacMac]So what exactly is meant by "layer"?
Timbre varies with volume, so the sound is more realistic.
I see that some pianos (Casio) feature "split and layers", while others (Roland) offer "layers, zones, and effects" ... which can be selected/configured.

So it seems that to them (Casio, Roland), layers means something quite different than sampling levels. Exactly what they mean I cannot say.

#1629764 - 02/28/11 08:37 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Kawai James  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Hamamatsu, Japan
MacMacMac, I expect 'layers' in this context refers to the ability to combine two or more different sounds (e.g. piano with strings). In the Kawai world this is referred to as 'Dual Mode'.

Cheers,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#1629790 - 02/28/11 09:43 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 824
hpeterh Offline
500 Post Club Member
hpeterh  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 824
Germany
In this interview, the interviewer explicitely asked about the samples, and how many "layers". He appeared a little bit to be a layman and did not know the right term ;-)

The Kawai man answered these samples are all totally new and incredibly big and "up to seven layers in the MP10". The other stuff that was talked about is not of interest here, it is commonly known stuff.

Ok, when he played the MP6, the interviewer wondered about the very "fat" sound and asked "is there reverb in?". Kawai man answered " no reverb, thats purely the pedal's effect".

;-)


1929 Galaxy Bl├╝thner Baby Grand
acer aspire m3300 AMD Phenom II X6

#1630668 - 03/01/11 01:16 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: hpeterh]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
craig son of berg Offline
Full Member
craig son of berg  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
WPB, FL, US of A
looks like kawai mp10's are not available until march 18th 2011. anybody hear different date?


play that one again sam
#1630842 - 03/01/11 05:53 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Kawai James  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Hamamatsu, Japan
craig2999871, may I ask where you heard this information?

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#1630856 - 03/01/11 06:12 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: Kawai James]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
craig son of berg Offline
Full Member
craig son of berg  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
WPB, FL, US of A
Originally Posted by Kawai James
craig2999871, may I ask where you heard this information?

Kind regards,
James
x

http://www.kraftmusic.com/catalog/keyboards/88keykeyboards/index.asp?product=8595
Out Of Stock
This item is currently out of stock. It is expected to arrive on 3/18/2011.

can you add any info about why everyone is out?

Last edited by craig1999871; 03/01/11 06:13 PM.

play that one again sam
#1630897 - 03/01/11 07:09 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Kawai James Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Kawai James  Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 13,066
Hamamatsu, Japan
Originally Posted by craig1999871
can you add any info about why everyone is out?


I'm sorry, I'm not involved in that side of the business - I just write the owner's manuals and brochures.

Questions relating to instrument pricing, distribution, and availability within the US are best handled by the folks at Kawai US.

Kind regards,
James
x



Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.
#1630972 - 03/01/11 09:09 PM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: Kawai James]  
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
craig son of berg Offline
Full Member
craig son of berg  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 173
WPB, FL, US of A
seems like alot of things are having production problems lately. must be the crappy economy. thanks obama! change alright.


play that one again sam
#1671931 - 05/05/11 10:17 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 6
Piotrek Offline
Junior Member
Piotrek  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 6
Hi!! I'm sorry for my language but I am from Poland ( forgive me! ). I've read a lot of text about yamaha cvp especialy cvp 500 series. I am intersted to buy yamaha cvp 505 or 509. I know the differences between those two models but i want to know if 509 is worth its price?? I know that 505 is very good digital piano but 509 has more speakers - that means it better sounds. But is it worth to spend 2000$ more comparing to 505????
I will be very greatfull for answer!!
I want to add that I've never played on 505 and 509.
I tried to 403 and 405 and I love it!!

#1671934 - 05/05/11 10:18 AM Re: yamaha cvp 5xx series can anyone shed some light on these? [Re: craig son of berg]  
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 6
Piotrek Offline
Junior Member
Piotrek  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 6
Hi!! I'm sorry for my language but I am from Poland ( forgive me! ). I've read a lot of text about yamaha cvp especialy cvp 500 series. I am intersted to buy yamaha cvp 505 or 509. I know the differences between those two models but i want to know if 509 is worth its price?? I know that 505 is very good digital piano but 509 has more speakers - that means it better sounds. But is it worth to spend 2000$ more comparing to 505????
I will be very greatfull for answer!!
I want to add that I've never played on 505 and 509.
I tried to 403 and 405 and I love it!!

Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Piano World 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World) our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.


Free Shipping on Jansen Artist Piano Benches
(ad)
Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
ad
Pierce Piano Atlas


(ad)
Pianoteq
Grotrian Concert
Royal
for Pianoteq out now
What's Hot!!
Why Do You Play The Piano?
-------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
-------------------
Piano Classified Ads
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Steinway D Concert Grand
by Cinjero. 06/23/17 12:48 PM
Yet another "repertoire suggestion" thread
by Morodiene. 06/23/17 11:34 AM
Piano Moving Question for a friend...
by lbonini1. 06/23/17 10:15 AM
Why do YouTube commenters hate Lang Lang so much?
by sara elizabeth. 06/23/17 07:33 AM
KAWAI MP7: my piano presets
by Nor. 06/23/17 04:09 AM
(ad)
Sheet Music Plus
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(ad)
Accu-Tuner
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Forum Statistics
Forums44
Topics180,407
Posts2,638,442
Members88,168
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Check It Out!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers


 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2017 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0