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first lessons in bach #1615076
02/08/11 01:01 AM
02/08/11 01:01 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Is this book any good for beginning Bach? I just learnt minuet in G minor and I learnt more from playing that one piece, then I have the whole Alfred series I have been working through.


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
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Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615195
02/08/11 08:51 AM
02/08/11 08:51 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Or would the Anna Magdalena book be better to pick up to start?


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615560
02/08/11 07:46 PM
02/08/11 07:46 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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ok nobody answer.


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615590
02/08/11 08:32 PM
02/08/11 08:32 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
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Stanny Offline
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Sorry for not answering, Joe. What does your own teacher suggest? Or are you self-taught?


~Stanny~

Independent Music Teacher
Certified Piano Teacher, American College of Musicians
Member: MTNA, NGPT, ASMTA, NAMTA
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615595
02/08/11 08:38 PM
02/08/11 08:38 PM
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findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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Self taught. Im supposed to be getting a teacher real soon. But this Bach piece got me goin nuts just wanting to learn more now. So i dont know which book to go with. Gotta get that teacher.


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615616
02/08/11 09:14 PM
02/08/11 09:14 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
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I'll answer.

There are several different publishers for "First Lessons in Bach".

There is the old Schirmer edition in two volumes that a number of people seem to disparage because of the editing. However, there is a new (2009) Schirmer Performance Edition (all in 1 volume) that includes a cd. This is the one I bought and I think it is just fine. The first 10 or so pages are performance notes for the individual pieces and also covers general things like phrasing, dynamics, fingering, and ornamentation. There is also the "Alfred Masterworks" volume which I understand is also quite good. Those would be the two I would suggest.

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615643
02/08/11 09:55 PM
02/08/11 09:55 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by dmsynck
I'll answer.

There are several different publishers for "First Lessons in Bach".

There is the old Schirmer edition in two volumes that a number of people seem to disparage because of the editing. However, there is a new (2009) Schirmer Performance Edition (all in 1 volume) that includes a cd. This is the one I bought and I think it is just fine. The first 10 or so pages are performance notes for the individual pieces and also covers general things like phrasing, dynamics, fingering, and ornamentation. There is also the "Alfred Masterworks" volume which I understand is also quite good. Those would be the two I would suggest.


Would you buy first lessons in bach over amb notebook?


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615692
02/08/11 10:59 PM
02/08/11 10:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
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dmsynck  Offline
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Let me clarify, both the "Alfred Masterworks" edition and the "Schirmer Performance" edition of "First Lessons in Bach" contain selections from the Anna Magdalena Notebook/s that Bach compiled in 1722 and 1725, although the name "Anna Magdalena Notebook" usually refers to just the 1725 volume. Basically, either edition contains the easier Bach pieces(minuets, musettes, etc).
The Alfred edition contains sixteen pieces while the Schirmer Performance edition has a total of twenty eight pieces, including some of the easier movements from things like the "French" suites and the "English" suites. These are typically pieces like gavottes, sarabandes, polonaises, etc.

Last edited by dmsynck; 02/08/11 11:07 PM.
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615699
02/08/11 11:09 PM
02/08/11 11:09 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615725
02/08/11 11:32 PM
02/08/11 11:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
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dmsynck  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615731
02/08/11 11:42 PM
02/08/11 11:42 PM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
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findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2009
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Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.


Yeah i can see that bach is great for left hand independence and motion. In alfreds I never move my left hand so it felt good to move it in a musical way that sounds exhilarating. Also alot of counterpoint and the man was just a genius. I wish i got into these sooner. and i usually dont play them without any ornaments seeing that i only know 2 minuets by him now. But wow. Im thinking u wana learn how to play keyboard learn bach. dude does like backflips with both hands. but the first lessons in bach are rather easy your right. but what level would they be at? sorry for the mixed thought racing rambling passage right there lol. eek

edit. alota people i see do that learn hands seperate. i find that twice as hard the work for me so i just go one shot all together so i know how they work in with eachother. but to each its own

Last edited by joeb84; 02/08/11 11:44 PM.

music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615745
02/08/11 11:59 PM
02/08/11 11:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
Full Member
dmsynck  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.


Yeah i can see that bach is great for left hand independence and motion. In alfreds I never move my left hand so it felt good to move it in a musical way that sounds exhilarating. Also alot of counterpoint and the man was just a genius. I wish i got into these sooner. and i usually dont play them without any ornaments seeing that i only know 2 minuets by him now. But wow. Im thinking u wana learn how to play keyboard learn bach. dude does like backflips with both hands. but the first lessons in bach are rather easy your right. but what level would they be at? sorry for the mixed thought racing rambling passage right there lol. eek

edit. alota people i see do that learn hands seperate. i find that twice as hard the work for me so i just go one shot all together so i know how they work in with eachother. but to each its own


Yes, I am most likely learning the same 2 minuets that you are learning. The same two everyone starts out learning(minuet in G major BWV 114 and minuet in G minor BWV 115, they should be played together as a pair). I also have learned the musette in D major BWV 126 and am working on the minuet in D minor BWV 132. I believe that these 4 pieces come in at about grade 3

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615749
02/09/11 12:08 AM
02/09/11 12:08 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
Full Member
dmsynck  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
An interesting side note - Bach was a church organist in the various cities in Germany he lived in and seemed to be constantly getting in trouble with the church elders for "using too many notes" as they put it.

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615750
02/09/11 12:09 AM
02/09/11 12:09 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member
findingnemo2010  Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.


Yeah i can see that bach is great for left hand independence and motion. In alfreds I never move my left hand so it felt good to move it in a musical way that sounds exhilarating. Also alot of counterpoint and the man was just a genius. I wish i got into these sooner. and i usually dont play them without any ornaments seeing that i only know 2 minuets by him now. But wow. Im thinking u wana learn how to play keyboard learn bach. dude does like backflips with both hands. but the first lessons in bach are rather easy your right. but what level would they be at? sorry for the mixed thought racing rambling passage right there lol. eek

edit. alota people i see do that learn hands seperate. i find that twice as hard the work for me so i just go one shot all together so i know how they work in with eachother. but to each its own


Yes, I am most likely learning the same 2 minuets that you are learning. The same two everyone starts out learning(minuet in G major BWV 114 and minuet in G minor BWV 115, they should be played together as a pair). I also have learned the musette in D major BWV 126 and am working on the minuet in D minor BWV 132. I believe that these 4 pieces come in at about grade 3


yup those are the exact 2 ones i just learned. minuet in g and g minor. i like the g minor one better. icouldnt make the shop today but hopefully tomorrow ill get down there and do what i can you know. What book are you working out of and do you have a teacheR?


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615751
02/09/11 12:10 AM
02/09/11 12:10 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member
findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
Originally Posted by dmsynck
An interesting side note - Bach was a church organist in the various cities in Germany he lived in and seemed to be constantly getting in trouble with the church elders for "using too many notes" as they put it.


I could see that. Yeah i was trying to find a style id like to play then i found this guy. wow. the way he just like fits notes together almost seeming at random but not quite and just sound so good. using too many notes. i could see that. smile

Last edited by joeb84; 02/09/11 12:12 AM.

music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615764
02/09/11 12:27 AM
02/09/11 12:27 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
Full Member
dmsynck  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
An interesting side note - Bach was a church organist in the various cities in Germany he lived in and seemed to be constantly getting in trouble with the church elders for "using too many notes" as they put it.


I could see that. Yeah i was trying to find a style id like to play then i found this guy. wow. the way he just like fits notes together almost seeming at random but not quite and just sound so good. using too many notes. i could see that. smile


A lot of people say that Bach's music has almost a mathematical precision and quality about it.

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615769
02/09/11 12:31 AM
02/09/11 12:31 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member
findingnemo2010  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
An interesting side note - Bach was a church organist in the various cities in Germany he lived in and seemed to be constantly getting in trouble with the church elders for "using too many notes" as they put it.


I could see that. Yeah i was trying to find a style id like to play then i found this guy. wow. the way he just like fits notes together almost seeming at random but not quite and just sound so good. using too many notes. i could see that. smile


A lot of people say that Bach's music has almost a mathematical precision and quality about it.


Most music is mathematical. Seems as everything goes back to numbers and I repeated Algebra 1 like 4 times, no joke. Numbers was never my thing.


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain
Re: first lessons in bach [Re: findingnemo2010] #1615772
02/09/11 12:38 AM
02/09/11 12:38 AM
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
dmsynck Offline
Full Member
dmsynck  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 91
Dallas, Texas
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.


Yeah i can see that bach is great for left hand independence and motion. In alfreds I never move my left hand so it felt good to move it in a musical way that sounds exhilarating. Also alot of counterpoint and the man was just a genius. I wish i got into these sooner. and i usually dont play them without any ornaments seeing that i only know 2 minuets by him now. But wow. Im thinking u wana learn how to play keyboard learn bach. dude does like backflips with both hands. but the first lessons in bach are rather easy your right. but what level would they be at? sorry for the mixed thought racing rambling passage right there lol. eek

edit. alota people i see do that learn hands seperate. i find that twice as hard the work for me so i just go one shot all together so i know how they work in with eachother. but to each its own


Yes, I am most likely learning the same 2 minuets that you are learning. The same two everyone starts out learning(minuet in G major BWV 114 and minuet in G minor BWV 115, they should be played together as a pair). I also have learned the musette in D major BWV 126 and am working on the minuet in D minor BWV 132. I believe that these 4 pieces come in at about grade 3


yup those are the exact 2 ones i just learned. minuet in g and g minor. i like the g minor one better. icouldnt make the shop today but hopefully tomorrow ill get down there and do what i can you know. What book are you working out of and do you have a teacheR?


I have the "Schirmer Performance" edition of "First Lessons in Bach". I chose that one over the Alfred edition because it has almost twice as many pieces and it comes with a cd, which is really helpful. It is about $10.50 brand new on Amazon.com, so not expensive at all. Yes, I did have a teacher for about a year, but just recently had to discontinue lessons for a while.

http://www.amazon.com/First-Lessons...mp;ie=UTF8&qid=1297225808&sr=1-4

Re: first lessons in bach [Re: dmsynck] #1615787
02/09/11 01:04 AM
02/09/11 01:04 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
findingnemo2010 Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member
findingnemo2010  Offline OP
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 1,588
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Originally Posted by dmsynck
Originally Posted by joeb84
Thank you. Wow. that stuff is amazing. never played nothing like it. All this time I was missing out.


Yes, Bach is fabulous for building technique, particularly hand independence(each hand playing a different melodic line). One small aside, most of the pieces in the AMB were not actually written by Bach himself. They were done by other composers, some of the pieces being written by some of Bach's sons and then Bach just collected them together and possibly made improvements. You don't start getting into pieces actually written by Bach until you get into the more intermediate and advanced stuff like the "little preludes", the "Two and Three Part Inventions", and the suites (French, English, Partitas, etc). Then there is the acknowledged pinnacle of keyboard playing, the preludes and fugues of the "Well Tempered Clavier". However, those are quite difficult and one could literally spend a lifetime mastering them. One thing about the pieces out of the AMB is that they are not particularly hard to play, but they are quite a challenge to play well, particularly when you add in all the ornamentation. Most beginners like me play them without any ornamentation in the beginning and then slowly learn how to add in things like trills and appogiaturas. The best way to go about learning how to play things like this is to play each hand seperately first and then once you have a grasp on each hand, put them together, but very slowly at first.


Yeah i can see that bach is great for left hand independence and motion. In alfreds I never move my left hand so it felt good to move it in a musical way that sounds exhilarating. Also alot of counterpoint and the man was just a genius. I wish i got into these sooner. and i usually dont play them without any ornaments seeing that i only know 2 minuets by him now. But wow. Im thinking u wana learn how to play keyboard learn bach. dude does like backflips with both hands. but the first lessons in bach are rather easy your right. but what level would they be at? sorry for the mixed thought racing rambling passage right there lol. eek

edit. alota people i see do that learn hands seperate. i find that twice as hard the work for me so i just go one shot all together so i know how they work in with eachother. but to each its own


Yes, I am most likely learning the same 2 minuets that you are learning. The same two everyone starts out learning(minuet in G major BWV 114 and minuet in G minor BWV 115, they should be played together as a pair). I also have learned the musette in D major BWV 126 and am working on the minuet in D minor BWV 132. I believe that these 4 pieces come in at about grade 3


yup those are the exact 2 ones i just learned. minuet in g and g minor. i like the g minor one better. icouldnt make the shop today but hopefully tomorrow ill get down there and do what i can you know. What book are you working out of and do you have a teacheR?


I have the "Schirmer Performance" edition of "First Lessons in Bach". I chose that one over the Alfred edition because it has almost twice as many pieces and it comes with a cd, which is really helpful. It is about $10.50 brand new on Amazon.com, so not expensive at all. Yes, I did have a teacher for about a year, but just recently had to discontinue lessons for a while.

http://www.amazon.com/First-Lessons...mp;ie=UTF8&qid=1297225808&sr=1-4


yeah the alfred one has less and type way too much stuff in it. i just wanna play. ill probly get the schirmer one tomorrow. only thing is the alfred got the cd. and that would be good because my timings not so good and im just starting out and i could check it out


music to me is kind of like putting together pieces of a puzzle
i call it the paino because its where i put all my pain

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Happy Birthday Lennie Tristano!
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“Spring Time” - A beautiful song
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Piano action issue
by kokatla. 03/19/19 04:31 AM
Practice session of Chopin prelude 3
by baudelairepianist. 03/19/19 12:26 AM
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