Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Teachers Forum rant about phone call

And then let her know what you would charge to teach her and that you have openings on Saturday evenings LOL!

You can always smile pleasantly and reply, "I seldom ask personal questions--- and I never answer them."

It seems to me my first piano teacher (who was a pro, both as a teacher and a performer) charged my parents five bucks an hour for my lessons. But, good God, that was forty years ago--- no, more than that now. A 1965 dollar was worth about ten or eleven 2010 dollars. You could buy a nice, modern four-bedroom ranch house on forty acres for twenty grand.

If this lady gossips about how expensive you are, Ann, it will only do you good. Do not worry about the retired librarian. Making such a comment to you was a fine display of 'no manners,' as well as 'out-of-date values.'

but it wouldn't work in this case because the person told AnnIK that she was thinking of doing some teaching, which is a very good reason to ask questions!

I still remember how one of the first families I taught were surprised how "high" my lesson rate was (it was low!). They had been playing $15 a half hour lesson in Australia which I thought was outrageous. Trouble was, the family were also friends so it was hard for me to squeak "but I'm worth it" with any conviction. But I stuck to my principles and it worked out.

For me, I always get the most value for money by going to the most expensive teachers I can find, in anything. It's actually cheaper per skill taught if you know what I mean. I'm serious!

Elissa your first rant was hilarious

Ann I've always liked the response along the lines of, "Oh, cheap lessons, yes I've heard of those. I wouldn't want any for myself but I've heard that some people like that sort of thing (raises eyebrows). And no, I can't do cheap music lessons anymore, I've really forgotten how. Mind you, I could pull out the 1940s piano tutor and call out note corrections from my chair; repeat. Would that be any use to you?"

(raises eyebrows) - I love it - is there an emoticon for that?!

Perhaps Ann, you could ask to meet her because you have some concerns about her recent phone call to you. Or send her a nice letter. You would need to be well-prepared, but it could work. I wrote a letter to someone about her similar complaint to me about the cost of piano lessons. She wrote back and apologized.

It's one of the hardest issues to deal with. By the way, $15/half hour is outrageously low, and one of the things I'm fighting against in our city. I often write teachers with credentials who charge too little and tell them so.

A lot goes into teaching besides credentials. Some things to mention:
your positive attitude, not everybody is as nice as you,
your hours are limited to times children are out of school,
your bills continue through the summer and other breaks,
your expense to become a piano teacher
your ability to handle children who are high maintenance,
your business risk, (reduced numbers some years, students leaving in-session)
your business expenses
your hope to one day replace your piano
your ongoing education.

Please make the effort to talk with her again, and assume she's got more on the ball than she's let on to you.

You mean this one?

Thank you for all the ideas expresssed. I like the idea of saying "Why do you ask?" but this woman had already expressed to me her interest in teaching when I saw her at our state federated music club convention. But still, I could have inquired first. Such as, "So are you making plans to teach as you mentioned last time I saw you?" Get the conversation started and focus on her...and not just deliver a one sentence answer.

This woman is out of date with what music lessons cost. I paid $22.50 per lesson 18 years ago! But that was for lessons with a harpist with a master's in performance. I'm sure music lessons with a librarian would have been much less! (Ha! Ha!)

The quote I gave of $15 per lesson is low. The serious teachers with master's degrees and have kids in guild and are the ones who students excel charge more. They tend to offer 45 minute lessons and charge quarterly.

This particular woman mentioned that she played "oldies" (which she herself hates) at her friend's party and that she hasn't touched her piano since. There is a real lack of enthusiasm and commitment. In our initial conversation I mentioned how teaching in the evenings means I don't get out to as many performances as I'd like. And right away she says she only wants to work 2 days a week. This is likely someone who would just pick any old books off a shelf and not bother to gets kids into performing.


I've tried to get over it with a reality check. And that is that it is unlikely that she will find students. And even if she does, they will get what they pay for. One or two students whose parents are looking for what they see as a bargain.

Candywoman, thanks for your suggestion that I talk with this woman again. If she approaches me again, I'll focus on her "How are your plans for teaching coming along?" and I will observe her...and keep my opinions, suggestions and lessons learned through experience to myself. I tend to let people into my inner circle of confidence too easily. She needs to be bumped back out to the level of acquaintance which is all she is to me.

It would be a win for everyone if she could do do it for what it really would be (and seems to want it to be); volunteering.

But when it's this gray area of her teaching for an extra activity/fun and maybe she feels like she should charge but is uncomfortable charging a decent amount, everyone loses. It's best to either charge a fee and be firm about it or be honest with yourself and if its just something for fun, do it as volunteer work.

I like Candywoman's idea of sending a letter. That way you can say all that needs to be said. Of course, it will probably come back to bite her in the end, but then what about those unfortunate people who go with her? Then they may think that all piano lessons are like that and give up all together rather than try to find a better teacher. I think demanding respect for your profession by someone who proposes to teach it is necessary. You're not doing it for her benefit, but protecting piano teaching as a profession.

$15/30 min, seems like extraordinarily good value to me.

with typos my post may not have been clear. I thought that $15 per 30min lesson was outrageously cheap for Australia (in 2007) so I had to convince the family to pay more than this. And this was in major cities.

This is the same fee as what women pay to have their fingernails polished ($15 per week for nails being done). Maybe I'll point that out next time someone acts outraged over the fee.

I mostly teach for free, but take problem students from a couple of accredited teachers, with whom I am on good terms with. Altho not accredited, licensed and have not studied 'how to teach', i do spend a fair amount of time in preparation for lessons. Both of my paying students have given me substantial raises.

the non payers are very special.

i would simply dismiss that woman.. If you let confrontations upset you they will. You could always tell her that non accredited teachers could expect to get minimum wage.. in KS, that would be $3.50 per 30 minutes, and don't forget the taxes.

Yes, I think dismissing her is best. When someone sincerely wants new information it's one thing. But when they are so chock full of their own opinions that they burst out with insults, it's another.

Thanks for all the support and comments. It makes it worth the distress to get to share ideas with all of you.

This concerns parents and students too, because we assume too readily that the person called teacher knows what they are doing. I was struck by the questions she ** didn't ** ask you:

- how do you prepare for a student's lessons?
- what planning do you do for a new student after interviewing him
- if you had one thing to pass on to me that you wish you had known when you started out, that benefits students, what would it be?

How much effort will this person put into teaching, and how will that affect students in the long run? When a person asks how much they should charge before asking how they should proceed in a new profession, possibly it speaks of an attitude.

Those are great questions. If a parent ever asked me that, after recovering from cardiac arrest, I might be inclined to offer some serious bonus, just to insure their student joins my studio.

Um? I meant the librarian who thinks she can just off and start teaching piano, and phones an experienced to ask only about prices.

So you'd like a parent to ask you these things?

Yes, I knew you were referring to the librarian.

And yes, those are very appropriate questions for parents to ask. Of course, the answers would reflect the concern of the questioner, but should be similar overall. Actually, I generally provide the answers to parents during the interview, even though they don't ask the questions.

Be kind to the librarian, if you ever talk to her again. There is a market segment to be served by her variety of teacher. And, there are people who don't like to understand that a teacher likes to pay his bills and expenses (including taxes, medical care, and retirement fund) out of his own income.

The same issue has come into public discussion regarding the big-box retailers, who pay for their discounted prices with such low wages that employees have to turn to state programs for medical care, neatly shifting a big-ticket expense onto the public's shoulders.

A more desirable market segment, for you, is students who would feel ashamed not to pay you a rate which would support you decently. I'm not a wealthy person, but my piano tech and teacher set reasonable and appropriate rates for their time and skills, which I am glad to pay.

I have a feeling you might not feel quite generous enough to refer low-price shoppers to the librarian... but that's ok; you can just leave it alone.

ha ha