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#1522122 - 09/24/10 09:09 PM Jumpin ABRSM  
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vladimiroir Offline
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Hello guys, i have taken private lessons with my teacher, i was planning to take the abrsm grade 8 exam,, is it possible for me to just go to a yamaha music centre and register myself for the exam?


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Czerny School of Velocity Op 299
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#1522128 - 09/24/10 09:27 PM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Elissa Milne Offline
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Why would you go to a yamaha centre?


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Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
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#1522181 - 09/24/10 11:50 PM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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You are 14. Do not register for ANYTHING piano related without your teacher.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522195 - 09/25/10 12:30 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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I registered myself for grade 8 (only grade I did) and got a merit. So yeh, go ahead.

#1522200 - 09/25/10 12:41 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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I'm confused too. ABRSM and Yamaha are two different music exam institutions.


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#1522205 - 09/25/10 12:50 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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chopin_r_us Offline
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Yeh, just do it through ABRSM.

#1522209 - 09/25/10 12:59 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Elissa Milne Offline
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chopin_r_us, you are obviously not speaking as someone with teaching experience?

vladimiroir - did you post your question in *this* forum because you are interested in knowing what *teachers* think about your options?


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#1522225 - 09/25/10 01:29 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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david_a Offline
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Whatever any other 14-year-olds on the board think, when you have a teacher, you do not go behind the teacher's back and enter yourself in exams and competitions. If you think your teacher is not doing a good job, of course you should consider discontinuing your lessons - but until you have already paid your final bill, had your last lesson, and said good-bye, you wait for the teacher to enter you in things. This is not a minor matter - it would be a serious @$$h013 move on your part to go through with this.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522237 - 09/25/10 02:32 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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sorry for the confusion, what i meant was ive already stopped having classes currently because shes shifted overseas,,, so yeah...


currently working on:
Czerny School of Velocity Op 299
#1522239 - 09/25/10 02:37 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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If you are on your own without a teacher, if she's not coming back, and you really think you can handle this, then of course go ahead. But it isn't easy - it's no fun to fail an exam - sign up only when you know you are ready to blow them away NOW, TODAY; don't sign up if you think you will be ready in a few months.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522244 - 09/25/10 02:59 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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To register for ABRSM grade 8 (well grades 6-8), I believe you need to have a minimum of grade 5 in either theory or Jazz performance. It's all up on the ABRSM website....

#1522261 - 09/25/10 05:29 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Have you learned the repertoire for Grade 8 ABRSM? The technical requirements? I think you probably need to do some research before registering for an exam. From your posts on the pianists corner it seems you have been working on pieces that aren't on the ABRSM syllabus.

#1522328 - 09/25/10 10:37 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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How does this work in the formal scheme of things? When I did my RCM exams, there is a place for the teacher's name. And how I do also reflects on the teacher, who by way of making a living also has a reputation to uphold.

What is your purpose for doing the exam, Vladomiroir? And why do you want to do it without a teacher's involvement?

Btw, my child made a number of music-related decisions around that age. However, he consulted teachers and people in the profession. It's the same whether you are a parent in your thirties, a young teen, or an adult student. Good decisions can't be made without getting good advice from somewhere.


#1522336 - 09/25/10 10:53 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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(Vladimiroir says he used to have a teacher but she left the country).

RCM in Canada will let you register for exams without a teacher; I don't know ABRSM's policies.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522349 - 09/25/10 11:24 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: Elissa Milne]  
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Originally Posted by Elissa Milne
chopin_r_us, you are obviously not speaking as someone with teaching experience?
Speaking as someone whose teacher said "I'm not going to enter you, you can enter yourself."

#1522355 - 09/25/10 11:29 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: chopin_r_us]  
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Originally Posted by chopin_r_us
Originally Posted by Elissa Milne
chopin_r_us, you are obviously not speaking as someone with teaching experience?
Speaking as someone whose teacher said "I'm not going to enter you, you can enter yourself."
Clearly then you had permission to do so. Completely different from going behind the teacher's back, and completely different from not having a teacher.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522365 - 09/25/10 11:39 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Permission didn't come into it, I didn't know I could enter myself.

#1522748 - 09/25/10 10:34 PM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Elissa Milne Offline
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OK.

Vladimiroir: it is absolutely possible to enter yourself for an examination. Most people who do this do not do very well, because they have no idea of the difference between being almost adequately prepared and being brilliantly prepared.

That is not to say that *having* a teacher will guarantee success - I know examiners talk about some parts of the world where they listen to woeful candidate after woeful candidate and get to the end of a depressing day where they have had to fail a high percentage of candidates.

Why do you want to sit the exam? Sharing some of this background might help the teachers in this forum give you some good advice as to how to successfully proceed.

And I'm still bewildered as to the role of a yamaha music centre in this proposition.


chopin_r_us: piano teachers tend to say "you can enter yourself" in a limited number of situations. One is when the piano teacher is entering no other students, and the student entering themselves will make administration of the entry fee and reports much easier all round. Another reason is so that a student can sit the exam at a different time (some exam boards, not the ABRSM, will examine according to the postcode of the person entering the student).

But probably most frequently, in places where examinations dominate the thinking of how piano students' learning should be structured (for example, the UK and here in Australia), teachers say "you can enter yourself" as a euphemism for "I don't want to be associated with the train wreck that your performance for this grade will be".


Teacher, Composer, Writer, Speaker
Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
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#1522834 - 09/26/10 01:32 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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It was the train wreck reason. It's like you go into a store, buy a candy bar and the vendor tells you when you can eat it - but, as said earlier, I got a merit.

#1522842 - 09/26/10 01:51 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: chopin_r_us]  
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I hope you switched teachers after that.

#1522843 - 09/26/10 01:57 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: chopin_r_us]  
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Originally Posted by chopin_r_us
It's like you go into a store, buy a candy bar and the vendor tells you when you can eat it
I don't get what this has to do with anything. Where did the candy and the store and the vendor come from, and what do they have to do with a piano student who was doing a poor job of his homework?

Unless... I think I get it, I think you mean your teacher sold you candy and then wouldn't let you eat it.

Your teacher taught you the RECIPE for the candy, you kept forgetting important steps - you were making stuff that looked disgusting and tasted like burnt rubber - and she wasn't going to allow you to sell that #$% and say it was her recipe.

Did I get it at least half right? smile


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522848 - 09/26/10 02:21 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Elissa Milne Offline
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yeah, I don't think an exam is anything like buying candy.

In fact, the vendor (the examination board) *does* tell you when you can eat your candy - on the day they designate for your exam. The piano teacher is like your mum saying it'll ruin your appetite for a good dinner.....


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Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
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#1522859 - 09/26/10 02:51 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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I don't want to start an argument but as a mature student I saw my teacher as a vendor and assumed part of that role was to enter and prepare me. Fortunately she took an interest after I entered myself. Dave, the only thing that tasted like burnt rubber were my scales - the pieces were all distinction marks.

#1522880 - 09/26/10 03:34 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Elissa Milne Offline
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Leaving the analogy aside.... it's a bit of a different scenario when an adult student (who is taking lessons) makes a decision about sitting an exam - to a young teenager (without the benefit of a teacher) making that same decision..... Issues of support, personal responsibility, and so on and so forth.....


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Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
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#1522885 - 09/26/10 03:49 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: chopin_r_us]  
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Originally Posted by chopin_r_us
as a mature student I saw my teacher as a vendor
This is interesting to me.

Did SHE see herself as a vendor? If she really did see herself that way, would you say the two of you agreed on what was the product for sale?

I'm honestly not sure that the "vendor model" (if we can call it that) is valid here. But maybe there's a case for it.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522887 - 09/26/10 03:56 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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No, I don't believe she saw herself as a vendor. But I did keep giving her money.

#1522894 - 09/26/10 04:29 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: chopin_r_us]  
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Originally Posted by chopin_r_us
No, I don't believe she saw herself as a vendor. But I did keep giving her money.
Not everyone you pay is a vendor. Not every financial transaction is a sale of goods. Pretending that transactions are all the same just because money changed hands makes life difficult and confusing. (As you have apparently found out.)

Lessons of any kind involve (at least) two people who both have a stake in the outcome.


(I'm a piano teacher.)
#1522899 - 09/26/10 05:06 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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vladi have you read the ABRSM site carefully? That should answer your question and provide you with links to the representative in your area who will advise you.

abrsm.org
and go to the Exams section. look under regulations and find Overseas Representatives.
There are registered centres for taking the exams; your yamaha place may or may not be one.

A quick read also found this important fact for you as a minor;
Candidates may be entered by a school, a teacher of music, a parent or guardian. Adult students may enter themselves.

#1522906 - 09/26/10 06:17 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Originally Posted by david_a
Not everyone you pay is a vendor.
Googling vendor the first hit I get says: vendor, or a supplier, is a supply chain management term meaning anyone who provides goods or services to a company.

Surely piano teaching is a service?

#1522972 - 09/26/10 09:53 AM Re: Jumpin ABRSM [Re: vladimiroir]  
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Back to the original poster, as a 14 year old you would have to have a parent enter you. Do you have all your pre-requisites already? Do you have proof that you've passed the grade 5 theory test?

The deadline for this October/November's exams has passed. If you enter now, it would be for next April.


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