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My daughter has been taking piano for 1.5 years. Her teacher is very nice. She uses the Faber series of books. My daughter likes the teacher and likes piano. She practices less than she used to mainly because I get frustrated with some aspects of her progress (e.g. sight-reading) and naturally she doesn't like that!

The reasons I am thinking of changing are that 1) the teacher writes the fingering over all the notes on all the pieces, which is why my daughter's sight reading is poor; she just presses whatever finger is written and doesn't bother much with the note reading because she doesn't have to. I have asked the teacher repeatedly to stop this (and now erase the fingering as soon as my daughter comes home) but she says my daughter's progress is quicker with this approach. And it is true that she can play pieces that she could not otherwise play. But I expect the fingering to be where the hand changes position, not on every note. 2) My daughter is not learning any theory and when I asked the teacher if she would teach her, she began explaining to her diminished thirds (!) I don't think she knows how to teach theory to kids but maybe that is not normally taught (when I was a kid, my lesson was 1.5 hrs, 1 hour playing, .5 hrs theory) 3) She doesn't seem give her feedback about her flat fingers or her pounding when she plays. The technical problems are likely because she was learning on an electric organ that is not touch sensitive, so that may be why the teacher doesn't say anything. We now have an acoustic piano, but I am concerned that she will continue to play with flat fingers and not learn anything about expressing herself in the music (but maybe the teacher will start giving her artistic feedback now that she has a piano, or maybe it is too early to give her this kind of feedback?)

My daughter is now 8 and after 1.5 years is at the 2A and 2B levels of the different Faber books (Classical, Jazz Popular Piano Adventures etc). That does not mean she can sight read at the level of these pieces but she has performed them at recitals because she has learned them from the fingering and from listening to the teacher play, and has a good musical and motor memory.

The plus side of this teacher is that she is a nice patient positive woman (much nicer and more patient than me, luckily for my daughter!), she plays well enough herself so models artistic expression when she plays the pieces for my daughter, and she has recitals for her students twice a year that my daughter really enjoys. She is also not far away.

I am torn at this point between continuing with her because my daughter likes her, or trying a different private teacher that is affiliated with the university music school (most of these perform, are RCM examiners and/or are affiliated with the Suzuki school and I don't know anything else about them), or switching to Music for Young Children so that my daughter would learn about chord accompaniment, get better at sight reading and theory. I met the teacher there who said her playing is already beyond what is achieved in MYC but that for theory she'd be starting out.

Sorry for the long post. I am have been turning this around in my mind for weeks... I'd really appreciate any help or advice, whether it is explaining the teacher's point of view, straightening out my misconceptions, or telling me I'm right, half-right or wrong.

Just because your daughter likes this teacher doesn't mean she couldn't also like another that is better.

But are the things that are bothering me legitimate complaints? My mother tells me "she's happy, she plays nicely, she's only 8, why change?" I feel like she should be learning more. But if she quits because the teacher is harsh or the work is too hard, she'll ultimately learn less.

I don't want to be quick to judge your daugher's teacher, as she may have reasons for how she approaches piano instruction the way she does. However, I agree that a number of things about this teacher are bothersome - sightreading, technique, and theory instruction are fundamental. The whole goal of music is meaningful expression, too, so that should be emphasized and nurtured from day one of piano lessons.

That said, I think you're wise to consider another piano teacher. I'd suggest scoping out several piano teachers, not just one. I suspect your daughter would be able to adjust to another teacher that makes learning fun for her and provides exciting performance opportunities.

Hopefully some of the more experienced teachers on this forum will be able to give you some of their valuable advice. I wish you all the best in getting the best musical education for your daughter.

1) I'd have a private talk with the teacher on the importance of sight reading. If she is playing in 2B, she should be able to play the book 1 material by sight. If she can't do that, then some work needs to be done. An occasional finger number or note name on the page is one thing, but every finger number written in will not help down the road.

I took two transfer students this fall, and both had the problem of a prior teacher who wrote all the finger numbers on the pieces, and we are working hard to catch up on note reading now.

2) Is the teacher not using the Theory books that go along with the series? That will at least give some theory to the child.

This may be a situation you can remedy by talking to the teacher. It's great to have a teacher that your child likes, but these issues you bring up could be serious. Hand position and technique, note reading, theory....they all need to be a part of a well rounded pianist.

On the subject of fingering: It's probably unwise to write out fingerings when the student clearly doesn't read notes well. That being said, I also strongly dislike the other extreme, where students ignore ALL fingering marks and insist on using crazy, illogical, and impromptu fingering. Numerous transfer students came to me without an ounce of fingering awareness--some don't even know their L.H. finger numbers!!

While you are umming and ahhing over whether or not to change teacher, you could get some theory exercise books and help her work through them at home. It's a good idea to do that anyway, as theory books just involve following a set of instructions, and working on that outside the lesson allows more time for specialist instruction during the lesson.

I don't like the idea of fingerings over every note. Can she sight read at all? For example tell the difference between steps and skips? It does sound like the teacher is rushing her through, perhaps wanting more advanced sounding students in her biannual recitals or something.

If you have this many misgivings, change. Follow your gut. Your mothering instinct is usually right.

This time, make sure you interview several possible teachers and find out the why and how of what they do and also see how they interact with your daughter. Just because she's only 8 doesn't mean she should be shortchanged in her skills.

Thank you for all your replies. From your answers, I feel like I am right to be concerned with these issues. I think that switching teachers is probably the route to go because I have already tried speaking to her several times but she says my daughter is doing great. I'm the one who sits with her during practice after I've erased the fingering and knows she cannot tell the difference between a skip and a step. She also mixes up B and D, can't recognize C on the bass clef, and still finds G by counting up from C (!) The teacher just sees her playing the song successfully at the next lesson and then starts in on the next song, fingering every note.

The theory books and the technique and artistry books in the Faber series are not used by my daughter's teacher. I bought the theory books anyway but wasn't that successful at incorporating them into her practice since her note identification was so weak that each exercise took forever. This summer I had her play a "musical notes" video game to practice note identification and now she can recognize the notes on the treble clef quickly although if it is an A, for example, she will sometimes play A in the bass clef instead and, if it is a G, she will say G-C-D-E-F-G and then play it.

Despite this low reading level, I think there may be something in the point about advancing her too quickly to benefit recitals. My daughter loves performing and does her best at recitals. The teacher says after she plays "This is her 2nd year of piano with me" and then parents with little kids in the first year (e.g 5 year olds playing Go and Wash Your Father's Shirt) come up to me and say they are so encouraged that their child could be playing like that next year.

I will check out other possible teachers. With all my agonizing, I hope I haven't left it too late to get her into a good person's schedule for the fall.

Thank you, all of you, for your helpful comments.

She is enjoying piano. Obviously she is also practicing.

So already she is somewhere in the 95th percentile of piano students. Those two elements alone set her apart. She isn't solid on note names and theory, but she is only eight.

I would be very cautious about risking that, unless you're very very sure she is going to end up in a conservatory.

Have you thought through and defined your goals for this child, and your reasons for sending her to piano lessons? Most parents realize the odds are against their child becoming a concert pianist, and send their kids for enrichment and the basics of a general music education - at least I did.

You are frustrated with this teacher but your child is not. Be careful you don't find a teacher who reverses this.

I actually have no ambitions that she go to a conservatory and I don't expect (or even want!) her to become a professional musician. I want her to be able to play to relax as she gets older, that she can read well enough to teach herself new songs when the lessons are over, that she can accompany herself singing for her own amusement, and that music be part of her life. She is also a compulsively creative kid so I think that a benefit of theory could be that when she makes up her own melodies on the piano she could come up with the left hand.

What I am afraid she will have if I don't change things is a repertoire of memorized songs that she can't add to, so that her musical education has made her a kind of player piano. But I don't have a good sense of how well she should be reading at this point and I don't want my uptightness or exaggerated standards to mess things up if things are actually going fine.

I know that teachers who make children happy are valuable. I did not enjoy my lessons as a child. I had the prototypical elderly nun with a pointer who marched me through RCM books. I was so stressed my love died out and I hated to play for people. I came back to it as an adult but I wish I had learned more before I quit, and I would have if I had liked it.

This is why I am struggling with the idea of gambling her happiness to get a better education that, if it didn't work out, might be a shorter education.

I would look fully at your choices. Find out who is available. Interview some other teachers. You may find someone competent and move on with confidence.

The Faber program is a good one. But it is not fool proof. Someone who ignores theory and technique books is not using the program well. To add additional finger number markings is being foolish. And as you've seen, you end up with a child who cannot read music.

Not really to both questions. I sit with my daughter during practice to help her figure out the notes once I have erased the fingering and to make sure she is playing the song as it is written (I guess like a lot of kids she is iffy on timing, not holding dotted quarters etc.) We do play duets together, which is her favourite part of practice (along with the part where I accidentally make mistakes and she gets to feel like I am human too!). She is good on timing when she plays with me, and likes the game of me slowing down and speeding up and her having to adjust to play in sync with me. We have done duets together in a couple of her recitals but I am nervous playing in front of people and don't like it at all. Last time I had her teacher do the duets so I could relax and enjoy the concert. We also do music together in the sense that we have pretend concerts where she comes in, bows and plays her pieces and my husband and I listen and applaud wildly. Before she was born we used to have classical music playing non-stop in the house but since our lives have moved from the living room to the kitchen we hardly put it on anymore.

Now that we have a piano in the house, I was thinking that if I do switch teachers I might get one who comes to the house to teach, and I could take lessons again too. I mentioned that to my daughter and she was delighted with the idea. Even my husband, who used to play organ, is interested in starting again. Her current teacher does teach adults, but you have to go to her studio which could make for a lot of back and forth if more than one person were taking lessons.

IMHO,

You shouldn't change your teacher.

If you daughter has the chemistry with the teacher and she is progressing then why changing ?, do you want her to have a more demanding teacher ?, she is only 8 and you are lucky enogh she likes playing piano, let it be !

Scenario 1: she keeps the same teacher she likes, she improves = everybody is happy

Scenario 2: the new teacher is more demanding, or just doesn't have the chemistry with your daughter = she may even quit playing

don't be so perfectionist, put the enjoyment of your daughter first

Sorry, the above post was in answer to a post that seems to have disappeared. The questions in the post were "Do you do music with your daughter? Is music a part of your life?"

How wonderful that your daughter is delighted by the idea of you both taking lessons. If you and your husband are ready to commit to daily practice, then you are ready for lessons.

Please let us know what happens. Hope you find a good teacher! If you don't find one to come to the house, perhaps someone could schedule your lessons back to back. Your daughter could get homework done or read while she waits.

yes indeed. I had a student transfer to me after 1.5 years of lessons. Finger #1 in the left hand was the pinky.

1. Fingering: If you let the kids pick their own fingering, most likely, they will NOT get the optimum ones. The competent teacher will mark the fingering at the critical spots and give the kids some freedom at the non-critical passage. Fingering or not has not much to do with sight-reading, playing a LOT of simple pieces will improve sight-reading.

2. Theory: Most teachers will not teach theory and playing in the same setting, it is just not conducive to the flow, imaging you have to stop playing, talk some theory, and then back to more playing. It is kind of like driving while reading the manual.

3. Progress: It is good for an 8 year old to reach PA 2A and 2B if all books are covered. It is a lot of material.

4. Flat finger and pounding: That is something I would want the teacher to correct right away, the longer you wait, the harder to correct.

This thing about writing in all the fingering is maybe a little
questionable, but even more questionable is you erasing
all of it as soon as she comes home. What does that accomplish
except to aggravate the child? If the student learns best this
way, then that's the way she should learn.

What this sounds like is a situation that we see over and
over and over again on this forum. A child likes the teacher and
yet the parent goes to great lengths to find fault in something
the teacher does--something actually trivial, that does not
warrant this kind of fault-finding--and comes here for
justification for switching teachers. But what is really happening
here is that the parent doesn't like the fact that the child
likes the teacher. A parent can come to resent--at the very
deepest level--the special bond that has developed between
student and teacher, and will find a way to get rid of the
teacher.

Also, when a child is separated from such a teacher--
and put with one that he does not like, which is just
great from the parent's perspective--he will
eventually lose interest and quit playing.