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Joined: Nov 2009
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....Yes time will tell and I may have selected a performance that came late in her show when she was a little exhausted.... Thanks for the answer -- and that could be, but I promise you that's not the whole story. I looked/listened a bit through several of her other youtube things, and as per what you said, indeed that one is the most problematic -- but the things I mentioned occur in everything. Her playing is an odd mixture of some good and interesting aspects, and aspects that are abominable for someone who purports to be at such a level. I think many people would say that she does indeed overreach in her choice of repertoire, and from her manner (both as described by you and from what we gather from her videos), IMO it's clear that her idea of herself exceeds the reality. She could still be a very good teacher for you, but that quality can be dangerous.
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You may think it's harmless fun to connect her playing to her teaching of you. Have you asked her and sent her this link?
I would be most upset if a student described my teaching AND showed a video of my playing. When she goes on youtube, she leaves herself open to criticism of her playing, which is her choice. She did not consent to criticism of her teaching or whether her teaching reputation aligns with her performing ability. I seriously think you should desist.
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You may think it's harmless fun to connect her playing to her teaching of you. Have you asked her and sent her this link?.....She did not consent to criticism of her teaching or whether her teaching reputation aligns with her performing ability. I seriously think you should desist. Admittedly speaking just as a student (and person) but not as a teacher -- but as a person who is highly concerned about privacy and confidentiality -- I don't agree. There's nothing out-of-line about what our guy did. Just about anything in anyone's personal experience is fair game for a discussion site, and a student's experience with a teacher is extremely fair game for here. No consent needed. As per some of what I said earlier, if a teacher doesn't want her video to be seen, she shouldn't have it on anything like YouTube. If D4v3 had taken some private video and posted it, that would be a different story -- but that's not what he did. Anything on youtube is totally public (as you noted). Also let me note that he posted the videos because (apparently) he thought they were very good! And he still might. I'll be interested to see what others think -- but I'll be fairly shocked if many people will buy what you're saying.
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I have to say after listening to some thing I'm a little afraid. It seems that some things she does are highly eccentric and unbalanced. It also seems that sometimes she comes up short on technique to fulfill those eccentric ideas.
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And, regarding her playing......I figured, OK, I don't like her personal style, but I'm sure she at least plays very well. But.....she doesn't. Granted, this is just a couple of pieces, and the Haydn is "OK" and arguably good; the Chopin is embarrassingly not. Aside from the obvious slips and glitches, let's talk tempo and character. Take a look at the opening indication (Presto non tanto). Does this have either the speed or flavor of that? And, is the tempo sustained consistently? Where it isn't, are the changes meaningful? This might be the most problematic recording of this movement on youtube; it's certainly the least capable one I've ever seen on there, and it's nothing that someone should want to display. If I didn't know that this was a performer, I'd guess it was an upper level intermediate student, ill-advisedly playing a piece that is beyond her ability.
I agree with your assessment of her playing. The Haydn seemed harsh, without any humor that you know must be in there. I am unfamiliar with this movement from the Chopin sonata and I was shocked when I heard it as it sounded so un-Chopinesque! Where's the rubato? Where are the dynamics and the voicing? Anyways, I do think that not every great teacher is a great performer, and this is one of those cases. Apparently she's done well as a teacher, having a student who won the Van Cliburn Amateur Competition, etc., so I think that speaks louder than her own performances. Still, she has them out there in public domain (as anything on the internet is public domain whether you intend that or not), and so that means it's free game. She's obviously not ashamed of her performances since it's on her own youtube site. I don't see any problem connecting a name with this story, as the post was not negative. It was just a story told in a humorous way and ended positively. If it were bashing the teacher at all, then I may have a problem with it as it could be slanderous to the teacher.
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Sorry for the double-post, but since I hadn't heard the Chopin before I decided to hear what another pianist would do with it and came across Katsaris' rendition. Absolutely amazing. Enjoy! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYY47zdi8So
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@ Morodiene
I did not say that the winner of the Amateur Van Cliburn competition was a student of hers only that the group of adults she wanted to set me up with were people which included that winner. You may have found that info by some other means maybe but I didnt state that.
@ Candywoman
I could see this being a harsh criticism if I berated her and said I didnt think she was worth very much but infact I stated now three times that I respect her tremendously and that my experience was just that, MINE. She is infact a very demanding teacher as I related in the retelling of my first experience with her.
As for her playing abilities, I am still an amateur so I dont really have that much of an ear for the apparent lacking in areas that some say exist. The videos were of pieces I like particularly and to say "Hey this is who I am taking from".
Again, Im no expert here, but as she said in my last lesson, there are different ways to produce different sounds at the key board and there is no "one correct way as far as technique is concerned" she believes that "sound" should flow through your upper arms to your hands and to the key board giving you proper arm weight and reducing hand tensions. Let me also note that she does not like to see exaggerated movements at the keyboard, minimal and efficient is what she likes.
I'll try this method and see what it does for me. If I am a better pianist for having taken from her then thats all I asked. She was a person who my last teacher who has a PhD in Piano performance recommended when he moved out of state and apparently he took private lessons from her too.
I'll give her a shot.
PS Candywoman I have had people who have read this post ask for her contact info to possibly take lessons. To each their own and they can decide if she is worth it or not but I dont think people would ask for contact info if this was a harsh critique as you are seeing it to be.
Last edited by D4v3; 09/02/10 09:58 AM.
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@ Morodiene
I did not say that the winner of the Amateur Van Cliburn competition was a student of hers only that the group of adults she wanted to set me up with were people which included that winner. You may have found that info by some other means maybe but I didnt state that.
OK, I guess it was just my misunderstanding, but I still don't get the distinction. So is this group you'd play with students of other teachers?
Last edited by Morodiene; 09/02/10 09:52 AM.
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@ Morodiene
First I did enjoy your Katsaris posting.
But that is the impression I got, this is a group of adults who are advanced to professional who play for each other in the Dallas Ft Worth Metroplex and are very relaxed and understanding if mistakes are made.
They get together once a month and if you have something prepared to play great! If not, go to listen to music and have fun.
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@ Morodiene
First I did enjoy your Katsaris posting.
But that is the impression I got, this is a group of adults who are advanced to professional who play for each other in the Dallas Ft Worth Metroplex and are very relaxed and understanding if mistakes are made.
They get together once a month and if you have something prepared to play great! If not, go to listen to music and have fun. OK, now I understand. And like I said before, being a great teacher does not mean one is a great performer, and the opposite is true. It sounds like this teacher will demand a lot from you, and it also sounds like that is exactly what you're looking for. Can't wait to hear part 2 of your adventures!
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....having a student who won the Van Cliburn Amateur Competition..... I think that's probably false. I know all the winners (there are only a few), and I don't think any of them are associated with her. I could be wrong, but I'd guess that at most they mean a person who made the finals and got one of the lesser prizes (which BTW would still be darn good). edit: I see that our guy clarified it himself. But I'm still doubting that it really means exactly what is being said, as opposed to something more like the above. As for your initial misunderstanding: I had understood it exactly as you did but thought it was somewhat false.
Last edited by Mark_C; 09/02/10 12:19 PM.
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....having a student who won the Van Cliburn Amateur Competition..... I think that's probably false. I know all the winners, and I don't think any of them are associated with her. I could be wrong, but I'd guess that at most one of the people made the finals and got one of the lesser prizes (which BTW would still be darn good). Ya, I think Dave clarified that for me.
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(see my edit.....I think it might not be exactly right even as clarified, but what the hey.....)
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On a side Note Mark I did like your Amateur Van Cliburn submission of Scriabin's Black Mass
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My teacher is a concert pianist from Russia too (he is Russian Jew), he competed at Tschaikovsky, Van Cliburn, Sidney etc. He always says that I need weekly lesson.
I never want to take weekly lesson, unless I have missed a lesson. I want to be fair with him. I found a very good excuse. I just told him "I cannot afford weekly lesson.". If I give other excuses, I know he will keep bothering me.
At first, I thought he just wants my money. But after taking lesson for 3 years with him, never once did he wasted my money in any lesson that he gave. Even when I came unprepared. He can make the lesson so useful. I am so grateful that he was even willing to take me as a student.
I know somebody who came from Russia, but hates Russian teachers. I cannot say a lot because I only had 3 of them. They are ranges from pretty good to excellent. The first one was a young guy who just escaped from Russia in 1991, he is a pretty good pianist, but has no desire to teach. I took lesson from him for about 8 months. Then I stopped taking lesson for 12 years. After that I took several lessons with a lady graduated from Lenningrad Conservatory, she is not an excellent pianist, but very good teacher for beginner. I had to quit because I had to move to different city. She is the first person who could teach me how to relax my hands, arms etc. Finally, three years ago, I found my current piano teacher.
Last edited by RonaldSteinway; 09/03/10 04:49 PM.
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At first, I thought he just wants my money. But after taking lesson for 3 years with him, never once did he wasted my money in any lesson that he gave. Even when I came unprepared. He can make the lesson so useful. I am so grateful that he was even willing to take me as a student.
I really like this. Not to hijack this thread, but how many times have we been asked to reschedule/cancel a lesson by the student because they didn't practice, only to be told that coming to a lesson when you haven't practiced is probably the best way to get back on the saddle again! Good teachers can always make lemonade out of lemons
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The issue isn't whether it was a harsh critique. It wasn't, btw. However, it wasn't just your experience you're relating, but rather your and her experience, a piano lesson. Maybe she doesn't mind at all. But my point is, you should check with her first. Some people would want to study with her more after reading your story, and others less. She has a right to her privacy as a teacher.
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What I am understanding is that the piano lesson is a private affair between a teacher and a student. As soon as the identity of the teacher is known, then this private interaction is out in the open, putting a known person under scrutiny. Do I understand your point correctly, Candywoman?
Thinking about this: There are times we need feedback in order to get perspective on a situation. That is why students sometimes describe aspects of lessons. It is also why teachers describe interaction with a given student. We students would not want to be identified, though, and the same the other way around.
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Seeing as how it was not a negative post, and the person giving the description was the student, I don't see any problem or any need to get "permission". I want my students to talk about me, that's how I get word of mouth advertising. If it were negative, then it could be seen as slanderous if the anonymity of the teacher was not maintained. Several people have contacted the OP because they are interested in studying with her from this post, so really there's no issue.
Last edited by Morodiene; 09/04/10 03:28 PM.
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