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Hi! I am new here and have a question for you all. I am shopping for a grand (or baby grand) for my home. My budget is $10K-$15K and I am looking at new or used. I went to the Kawai dealer yesterday and was given what I think is a great quote for a new RX-2 BLAK. Here is my question: the dealer said that I needed to buy it soon because prices are probably going up in September. Something about the yen/dollar ratio and that these companies keep raising prices on them. Is this true? Or is this a tactic to make a quick sale? He said it would be going up about $1000 after September. Are piano prices really going up right now? I would think they would be holding steady, or falling, given the economy. Thanks for your input.

Don't let him pressure you. Believe when I say you can come in with a check for the original price and still get it later. It's a buyers market. Plus don't rush because of a sale, I did and still regret it. There are a million pianos out there, take your time and enjoy the search.

I can't tell you the seller's motivation for informing you of a likely price increase. It's not unheard of for retailers to warn of impending price increases to provide a sales enema.

OTOH, the yen/USD exchange rate is just awful from the USD side of the fence..historic lows really. If the dealer can sell you a new RX2 Blak within your stated budget, you are hardly being taken advantage of.

Check Piano Buyer (link in the left column) to see where your price stands in relation to typical market price.

Price increases can come at any time. If they are wholesale price increases to the dealer, they mean more than just taking the air pump to the MSRP.

There is no real urgency but it is still a great piano. Maybe you can spin the urgency in your favor and get a bigger discount "right now, today!"...

Prices do go up. Increases used to be pretty predictable but not any more. A crappy economy doesn't make COSTS go down. PRICES already have - that's why so many dealers have shrunk or are already gone. You're getting good prices. If you like the piano, buy it, if not, keep shopping. There are other similarly good choices.

I don't know if there is some impending September increase from Kawai, however is there some reason you'd rather wait than enjoy the piano now? I think that is the best reason to buy. The piano doesn't look nearly as good in their showroom as it will in your home.

If a new RX-2 Blak is offered at $ 15k, which means 45% below Fine's SMP or even 55% below the MSRP this means the whole US pricing structure is a jungle. But this is hardly anything new.

schwammerl.

I was told the same thing about Yamaha. I have news for Yamaha. You can arbitrarily raise prices as much as you wish. Your price increase this year is so absurd and so not in-tune with economic reality that pretty soon street prices will by 75% off MSRP. It's ridiculous and no other industry is emulating what the "higher end" piano industry is doing right now.

I was insulted when I found out how much the MSRPs of things like the C6 and C7 went up this year. It's a joke.

When I trade up to a bigger grand in a few years I'll just get a rebuilt piano or buy a 7 foot Chinese make, but I'll never pay $50,000 for a piece of 6-7 foot Asian wood.
I can charge $200 for a hamburger... people will buy one elsewhere or offer me $2 and I can take it or leave it.

Yes I don't quite understand Yamaha's "strategy" either.



Kawai is following Yamaha's lead. On paper at least.

I'd recommend shoppers to find competitive pricing (same brands or otherwise) that are well-grounded in facts and circumstances when negotiating. Buyers don't just pay the dealers' initial offers, right?

Anyhow mathmom has a good deal as it is.

Make sure you and your daughter are happy with the sound, feel etc... At least listen and try two or three other brands. Don't buy the first piano you evaluate until you have looked at others. Kawai is a great brand, so don't get me wrong. Even if the prices do go up by the end of September, you have some time to carefully make this important decision.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

yadayadayada

Here's a little piece of "economic reality". In August of 2007, a US dollar bought 121 Japanese yen. Now it buys 86 Japanese yen. China is in a position to benefit from subsidizing the US dollar since it is the principal buyer of US debt. Japan is not and is not. China's skilled labor costs are quite low. Japan's are among the highest in the world.

If you don't like a Yamaha or Kawai dealer's asking price for "a piece of Asian wood", don't buy it, but don't think there's some sort of conspiracy to gouge you.

I don't feel there's a conspiracy... too many choices in this buyer's market to be fixing prices. It's just unfortunate for consumers, and probably unfortunate for Yamaha and Kawai as well. At higher prices people are going to move toward Estonia, Schimmel, Walter, etc. If buyers don't know about those brands, then they would "settle" for Korean or Chinese brands.

The reason that "it's a buyer's market" is that there aren't many buyers. I suppose you're right that if people read here and come across enough of the pride-of-ownership exhortations of Estonia, Schimmel, and Walter owners, they may become interested in those brands, but they have to be able to find them. Even if they do, the actual selling prices of those pianos might still be significantly higher than the actual selling prices of Yamaha and Kawai. Bear in mind the OP's stated budget and the piano that (s)he's considering.

You may also be right on people settling for something at a lower price. That's why Yamaha and Kawai have shifted a lot of production to China or Indonesia. Yamaha will do whatever it needs to do with budget lines, offshore production, and engineered cost savings to meet North American shopper's price expectations. It will also use its strength in digital pianos to offset the growing lack of interest in acoustic pianos here. Kawai will follow suit as best it can. However, the main marketing focus for acoustic pianos will turn (and is turning) to markets where there are greener pastures to graze, where it's not "a buyer's market".

Both Yamaha and Kawai have problems in the home market as well. Twenty years of rotten economic news since the bubble burst have made a new piano purchase and piano lessons a tougher sell to parents. Taking production overseas means taking jobs overseas. In terms of Japanese core cultural values, this is a real no-no.

I disagree with the sentiment here that the OP should sample tons of pianos before deciding. If (s)he really likes that Kawai RX2, she could simply buy it, bid adieu to the constant puerile PW bickering about X being better than Y, Z being the best of all, etc., and simply enjoy making music on a fine piano with a good name, good resale value, consistent build quality, and great customer support.

I can't believe how cheap those RX-2 BLAKs are selling for in America.
Sounds like a great deal on a great piano to me.

Add to that a distribution company that has a somewhat fixed overhead with a significantly shrunken consumer base and it all adds up to wholesale price increases and less flexibility on the part of manufacturers. In the case of the Blak piano in question, the good news is that Kawai has made improvements in the product with the price increase. Hopefully customers feel that the improvements can offset the additional cost.

I think we can all agree that some salesmen make stuff up - unfortunately that's not going to change. What does ring true to me in this situation, however, is that price increases are a sign of the times squeezing both dealer and consumer.

OP hasn't confirmed the RX2 BLAK price she was quoted as yet - posters are assuming it was quoted in the stated budget. OP stated what the budget was, and then went on to say she got what she believed was "a great quote" for the RX2 BLAK. Did not mention specifc $ amount for this particular piano.

Perhaps the new forum member will check back in on this thread that she started and clear up the question before everyone gets all out of whack & takes the jump off the cliff.

Yes indeed. The i's are not crossed and the t's are not dotted.

Should mathmom retire from the thread, her opening post might be viewed in a way that no mom would like.

No worries about you Nancy. You're much too even-tempered to jump off a cliff. Don't know about Chris though. Opera singers are trained to be overly dramatic. He might just go for the grand gesture.

Maybe we should tie a figurative rope to Chris...just in case.

Ah, mathmom... avanti a Dio!!!!

(get it, Turandot?)

If you don't maybe you know "uccisi"?

I'm confused. Are you talking Manon L'Escaut or Tosca? Either way, unless you've gotten yourself neutered, it might be a bit out of your singing range.

"Uccisi"? I doubt it. Just keep your sense of humor and you'll be fine.

ah, Tosca... Turandot... no, not neutered yet... although I see these big countertenor fees these days and it sort of makes me think...