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That wasn't the point.

I must have missed it, then.

I agree with that sentiment. Quite true.

I do believe that these are 3 of the most common subjects of all art, since the beginning of time.

And what exactly does Hitler's love of Beethoven and Wagner reveal about his soul.

Your respect for Tupac contradicts your reasoning for disliking rap mentioned before. Many of Tupac's rap "songs" do indeed contain the themes you mentioned before. Is there something in particular regarding Tupac that you have respect for?

Can't speak for Ludwig, but Wagner was a proto-Nazi in his worldview. Perhaps one of the reasons I have a distaste for his music despite he undoubted excellence as a composer.

Mattardo, i think it makes sense to be against "some rappers" for social reasons. Obviously the message is just not good . But not all rappers are like this.

This is one of the points that needs to be cleared. Gangsta rap is just a fraction of Hip hop.

Can't speak for Ludwig, but Wagner was a proto-Nazi in his worldview. Perhaps one of the reasons I have a distaste for his music despite he undoubted excellence as a composer.

And what exactly does Hitler's love of Beethoven and Wagner reveal about his soul.

Well I as 13 when I used to listen to him and I didn't speak English much - but I remember his videos weren't disgusting and there were a few songs, which took me forever to translate and the were pretty good. Something like,

"Though I walk through the valley of heck the shadow follows me
Wisdom hard to swallow tomorrow expect apologies
You probably panic, stranded in search of a better planet
Realism hard to understand, we stand slanted
and still stranded, merciless thieves stole the best of me
I pray to black Jesus to please take the rest of me
And still, the best of us build, and reach monetary gains
Some of us kill, but still, most of us can change
if we search deeper, god bless the hustler, curse the first sleeper"

Maybe I'm wrong and he was another one of those idiots. But at least there were 2 or 3 great songs.

At least be creative, like Mozart, and sing about sex in a hidden, delicate way.

Is it just me, or is it just plain inappropriate to be singing about shooting people, girls' behinds or certain sexual activities? Who the heck wants to listen to that? I hear enough swearing in my own practice room, and frankly I think whatever happens in the bedroom (or wherever..) shouldn't be publicized for millions to know. The only rapper I have/had respect for was 2Pac.

Mindlessly bashing and generalizing an entire genre of music one knows little about also reveals a lot about an individual.
I'm not into it myself and do not like most rap/hip hop that I've heard, but this thread made clear to me that discussing anything outside classical music is pointless on this forum because you will simply run into a wall of people who will keep saying "no it all sucks" without providing any arguments.

At least be creative, like Mozart, and sing about sex in a hidden, delicate way..

The burden of proof is on the supporters to explain to us why rap is so good. I think many of us have explained that it is simplistic, repetitive and lacks any kind of development. Tellingly, there's been no counterargument to that by the supporters.

I can see your cheeks blushing clear across the World Wide Web !

Have you read Homer ? Have you never seen the priceless Greek urns, depicting what we would call orgies ?

As for girls' behinds, ever read Les Liasons Dangereuses ? The marvelous letter that the Marquis de Whats-his-name writes to Madame de Whats-her-name, professing his inexhaustable love for her, using a prostitute's butt as writing table !

These are just a couple of references. The list would be infinte, stemming from every culture.

Don't interpret me to mean that Eminem or 50-cent are our modern-day Homer. Simply that these themes in rap music do not put it outside of the world of art, to the contrary they are perfectly coherent with great artistic achievement.

Are you objecting to this because you find it offensive, or is it because you consider it dangerous to society in some way?