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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1450638 06/05/10 05:35 AM
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xiangjiao Offline OP
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Exciting new guys! I've located a Korg sp170! But, it's 47 miles away from my house... I'll have to find some time later to try it out ^^


book// Alfred's Book I
song// Blow the Man Down
dreams// Cruel Angel Thesis, Just communication, I Say Yes, Cannon in D, star fox 64 opening theme
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Yamaha p85// started 6-11-2010
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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1450665 06/05/10 06:59 AM
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I wouldn't buy any DP without trying it first and the Korg has it's lovers and haters. I like it, it has a great responsive action but it's not obviously hammer like. On most hammer action DPs you can feel the hammer swinging when you press the key, you can't feel that on the SP170 which might put you off. It has a good weight though and feels very responsive. When I played one there was an acoustic upright in the showroom that felt almost identical.

It has great sounds and the amp/speakers are probably better than anything else in it's price range.

On the downside it has no midi in which isn't a problem unless you want to control the Korg from another keyboard or play midi files from your computer through it.

It also has a very unorthodox method of changing settings, you hold down the top three notes to enter edit mode then you press other keys to change voices etc. There's no marking to tell you what to press, you have to consult the manual! Not good design in my opinion but the few owners that have posted about it find the system OK.

The Yamaha P85/P95 (they're almost identical just a slightly different range of voices) are decent enough DPs but old. The samples aren't as good as more modern models and I'd say the same about the action though that's a matter of taste. Yamaha's build quality is probably better than the Korgs which is definitely built to a price.


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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: BazC] #1450797 06/05/10 12:04 PM
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Xiangjiao,

Ordered my Korg SP170 from Sweetwater because of their 30 day return policy. The Korg is very spartan, the Casio PX 130 wins hands down on features. I kept the Korg because I like the piano voices and the built-in sound better. The Korg keybed has a very nice feel to me, but it only has two sensors, so you can't repeat as fast as with the 3-sensor Casio keybeds. The same difference as between an upright and grand action, I have read on this forum.


Bob M

Charles Walter Model 1520
Yamaha NP 30, NP 11, PSR E333
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: Bob M] #1450911 06/05/10 03:08 PM
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xiangjiao Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Bob M
Xiangjiao,

Ordered my Korg SP170 from Sweetwater because of their 30 day return policy. The Korg is very spartan, the Casio PX 130 wins hands down on features. I kept the Korg because I like the piano voices and the built-in sound better. The Korg keybed has a very nice feel to me, but it only has two sensors, so you can't repeat as fast as with the 3-sensor Casio keybeds. The same difference as between an upright and grand action, I have read on this forum.


what exactly is a 2 or 3 sensor?


book// Alfred's Book I
song// Blow the Man Down
dreams// Cruel Angel Thesis, Just communication, I Say Yes, Cannon in D, star fox 64 opening theme
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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1450922 06/05/10 03:23 PM
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Originally Posted by xiangjiao
what exactly is a 2 or 3 sensor?

On a 2 sensor keyboard you have to lift the key and mute the playing note before you can play it again.

On a 3 sensor keyboard you can lift the key part way and play it again without muting it - like on a real piano.

Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: dewster] #1450938 06/05/10 03:41 PM
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xiangjiao Offline OP
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I'm guessing the Yamaha also only has 2 sensors?


book// Alfred's Book I
song// Blow the Man Down
dreams// Cruel Angel Thesis, Just communication, I Say Yes, Cannon in D, star fox 64 opening theme
_________________________

Yamaha p85// started 6-11-2010
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1451044 06/05/10 08:34 PM
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Yes, the P-85 has 2 sensors as does the Korg SP-170. You won't be able to repeat notes as quickly. You would have to take the leap to the P-155 for a 3 sensor DP in Yamaha.

Last edited by galaxy4t; 06/05/10 08:42 PM.
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: galaxy4t] #1451204 06/06/10 01:37 AM
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GH action (in P-155) has also only 2 sensors like GHS action (P-85/95). In this price range only Casio has 3 sensors keyboards. When I compare with my previous Casio PX-330 now (on GH action) I have to release the key a little bit higher to get a tone again (~50% on PX-330, ~75% on P-155). Also velocity of repeated notes are lower on Yamaha then on Casio. But I should not say that it's wrong. Generaly P-155 fits me better and feel more piano realistic then PX-330.

Last edited by pesk; 06/06/10 01:39 AM.
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: pesk] #1451234 06/06/10 04:36 AM
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Dewster (if you ever come back in here and read this),
I was looking through older posts (again) and I noticed that you recommended the Yamaha p85 over the Casio px130.
But, in the thread I had the impression you were advocating for the Casio. eg: pointing out the 3 sensor thingy, calling yamaha "old" ect...

Has your opinion changed? If not, why would you recommend the Yamaha?
This is the thread I'm talking about btw: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...fused%20of%20buying%20Casio%20PX130.html


book// Alfred's Book I
song// Blow the Man Down
dreams// Cruel Angel Thesis, Just communication, I Say Yes, Cannon in D, star fox 64 opening theme
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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1451294 06/06/10 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by xiangjiao
Has your opinion changed? If not, why would you recommend the Yamaha?

Yes, my opinion has changed somewhat. The triple sensor in the Casio is rather unexpected for this price range. The Casio sound is also very good for the price. Though it makes you wonder though what kind of corners they are cutting to get these features to you. If you like the Casio sound and key feel, and if it holds up, then it is a tremendous value. If it breaks or wears out after a couple of years use, then not so much.

Kind of like buying a $300 PC package, you pretty much know everything in there will be crap, but they've jiggered things to the point where the feature list is impressively complete. I'm not saying Casio DPs are crap, I just wonder how long they might last given the features and price.

Yamaha on the other hand, with the release of the P-95, a slight respin of the creaky old P-85, appears to be falling behind in this market segment, which makes it hard to recommend anything from them at this price point. But the P-85/95 might be a better fit for you if you like the sounds and key feel.

You might also look at the used market. I'd take a used P120 or P140 in good shape over a new P85 if they were priced the same.

You really need to demo these things yourself though. There are all kinds of mitigating factors at work, and you can most likely rule out contenders rather quickly once you have access to them and spend a little time checking them out. Trust me, things you hate will jump right out at you! smile

Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: dewster] #1451347 06/06/10 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by dewster
Originally Posted by xiangjiao
Has your opinion changed? If not, why would you recommend the Yamaha?

Yes, my opinion has changed somewhat. The triple sensor in the Casio is rather unexpected for this price range. The Casio sound is also very good for the price. Though it makes you wonder though what kind of corners they are cutting to get these features to you. If you like the Casio sound and key feel, and if it holds up, then it is a tremendous value. If it breaks or wears out after a couple of years use, then not so much.


dewster, I have to say that, although not "perfect", the two-sensor PHA-II in my 700GX is more than adequate for me. Although for a low-end slab the Casio is a good piano, it really doesn't match the feel or playability to the 700GX. I can still repeat notes without coming all the way back up, and the small repetition height differences aside (if any) are pretty easy to get used to. I'm sure I'll transition back to my acoustic seamlessly in a few months when I'm back home.

I'd still probably recommend a P-155 for a non-gigging musician over the Casios if the budget allowed it, though the PX-830 is admittedly pretty damn close and almost a wash. Yamaha GH is a pretty good action, though Yamaha better get their collective act together. Between the controversy of the new CPs and the older lineup, Yamaha really needs to start putting some NW-GH3 with ivory action in their mid-range and high-end fast before they get passed over by their competitors.

I'm sure you'll get your PHA-III ivory Roland wishes at NAMM 2011, though...


RD-700GX + SN Piano Expansion
If you're playing and you know it, wash your hands! If you're playing and you know it, no sanitizer!
If you're playing and you know it, and don't want your keys to show it,
If you're playing and you know it, clip your nails!
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: pianodilemma] #1451422 06/06/10 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by pianodilemma
dewster, I have to say that, although not "perfect", the two-sensor PHA-II in my 700GX is more than adequate for me. Although for a low-end slab the Casio is a good piano, it really doesn't match the feel or playability to the 700GX. I can still repeat notes without coming all the way back up, and the small repetition height differences aside (if any) are pretty easy to get used to. I'm sure I'll transition back to my acoustic seamlessly in a few months when I'm back home.

I'm not trying to knock the PHA II in the RD at all. It's just that a triple sensor in such a low end instrument is interesting and definitely adds to its value.

I hope it is also raising the bar of what people come to expect in a DP.

Originally Posted by pianodilemma
I'd still probably recommend a P-155 for a non-gigging musician over the Casios if the budget allowed it...

Oh, same here, but I believe that is over budget for the OP.

Originally Posted by pianodilemma
Yamaha GH is a pretty good action, though Yamaha better get their collective act together. Between the controversy of the new CPs and the older lineup, Yamaha really needs to start putting some NW-GH3 with ivory action in their mid-range and high-end fast before they get passed over by their competitors.

Yes, even for an industry infamous for doing nothing over long periods of time, they are resting on their laurels a bit too much IMO.

Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: dewster] #1451463 06/06/10 03:31 PM
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If it was me, I would trust Yamaha, rather than going for 3 sensor Casio; I don't like their keyboards, also Yamaha piano sounds better. Yamaha sold a lot of P-85, and will also sell a lot of P-95; cheap, lightweight, with weighted keyboard and speakers. Keyboard is not great, but good for the price; same with speakers smile

Though I didn't try Korg.

Last edited by kiedysktos.; 06/06/10 03:32 PM.

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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: kiedysktos.] #1453111 06/09/10 01:43 AM
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xiangjiao Offline OP
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Update! I'm going to buy my keyboard this weekend since I'm done with finals!
I'm not sure which one I will get yet exactly~ I'd say 40% chance of p85 and 59% chance of px130! (1% something else occurs)
Please put in your last minute feedbacks to help me decide! It call comes down to this XD


book// Alfred's Book I
song// Blow the Man Down
dreams// Cruel Angel Thesis, Just communication, I Say Yes, Cannon in D, star fox 64 opening theme
_________________________

Yamaha p85// started 6-11-2010
Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: xiangjiao] #1453576 06/09/10 05:35 PM
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Since xiangjiao seems near a decision, and there has been a lot of back and forth on "feel", perhaps another question would not be too rude. Since Korg manufactures nothing, Does anyone KNOW who made the keybed in my SP 170? Or the SP 250, for that matter--since I would be surprised if the different named actions in Korg literature are anything more than advertising/marketing language (it seems more likely that the "chip" sets would change between models, than the keybeds). How about Jim C.--have you ever had a SP 250 apart to compare with other "stage" DP actions?

Today at GC, it seemed like the Korg keybed was more like the Yamaha CP33 than the P85, but that is pretty speculative on my part, and I can't assume that Korg even uses the Yamaha actions, maybe it's Fatar, and I don't know what other contract manufacturer in China might be making DP keybeds for either brand.

Thanks in advance for anyone who is willing to go off on this tangent.


Bob M

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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: Bob M] #1453629 06/09/10 06:56 PM
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Korg used to use Yamaha actions several years ago...this was after Yamaha bailed out the company.

It's been said here on this forum, and a few others, that they now use Fatar actions exclusively (as do some Rolands).

I played a SP-250 that was well used, and the keys clicked and clacked like an old typewriter, but they all sounded and the velocity sensitivity was still good...and the new one I played in a store had uneven gaps between the keys.

I wouldn't at all be surprised if the SP-170 is using an even cheaper Fatar action than the the SP-250, but maybe it might be a newer type as well, and could possibly wear-in better.

Snazzy


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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: snazzyplayer] #1453660 06/09/10 08:01 PM
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Thanks for the fast and informed reply, Snazzy. The GC salesman today said Korg used Yamaha keybeds, now I can see where that was coming from. I guess only wear will tell whether my SP 170 is better or worse than the earlier Korg DP's.


Bob M

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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: Bob M] #1453783 06/10/10 12:38 AM
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I've also heard that Korg bought the old Technics factory where they now produce their own keybeds, who knows for sure what the truth is though.


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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: BazC] #1453799 06/10/10 01:14 AM
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Really, you mean this facility in Kyoto?

http://www.korg.co.jp/Product/DigitalPiano/RH3/

James
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Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.

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Re: Korg sp170 or Casio PX130? [Re: Kawai James] #1453859 06/10/10 04:59 AM
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No idea, I read a post by someone who said they had been told by a Korg representative that they were now making their own keyboards in the old Technics factory. Whether it's that one you linked to I don't know. That page does support the idea that Korg do manufacture their own though.

I did a Google translate of that page and it makes fascinating reading, I just wish I understood what it meant lol!

Google Translation


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