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Fatar Numa Nero #1378940
02/20/10 04:28 PM
02/20/10 04:28 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 138
C
CruelStrings Offline OP
Full Member
CruelStrings  Offline OP
Full Member
C

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 138
In my search for the most authentic grand piano action in any DP or masterkeyboard, I stumbled upon this controller:

The Fatar Numa Nero

Quite a few pianists on different forums have praised this controller for being virtually indistinguishable from a grand piano action.

The features:

[Linked Image]

• 88-KEY wood keys Graduated Hammer
action Keybed (TP4OWOOD)
• TOUCH SENSITIVE control panel
• large LIGHT BLUE graphic display
• 2 assignable stereo jack pedal INPUTS
• 1 assignable FLUORESCENT wheel
• 16 independent MIDI channels assignable to all
controllers
• 4 KEYBOARD ZONES for splits and layers
• 3 factory DYNAMIC curves
•15 memory user locations for VELOCITY DYNAMIC
COURVES saving
• 64 memory locations for PATCH saving
• 2 MODE operation
1st EDIT to create patches with all MIDI
parameters
2nd PLAY to play keyboard and controls, and
some fast MIDI changes ( program change, midi
channels, transpose, mute...)
• assignable AFTERTOUCH
• PANIC buttons
• YOU PLAY feature is the best and fastest way to
create a dynamic curve in REAL TIME
• MIDI out
• USB class compliant - to connect with PC to
load/save FIRMWARE UPDATES presets
• XP-VISTA- MAC compatible, no drivers required
• POWERED via USB (cable not included) and/or
power adapter included

Cost:
Roughly 1200 Euro in Germany

Some videos of people using it:

German music store praising it as being by far the best (in german:)


Unboxing:


In action with Tyros (just listen to the dynamics) :


Has anyone here tried it and can give some valuable feedback, whether this really is the holy grail of controllers?

Cheers

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Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: CruelStrings] #1378954
02/20/10 04:52 PM
02/20/10 04:52 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 537
The Boogie Down
jscomposer Offline
500 Post Club Member
jscomposer  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 537
The Boogie Down
I wrote a rather unflattering review of it a little while back. In hindsight, I was too harsh. But it really did [censored] me off that 1) the power adapter didn't work, 2) it only comes with 2 pedal inputs, which, for a keyboard passed off as some be-all-end-all controller for pianists is truly an insult to my intelligence, 3) soft rapid repeats sent occasional MIDI velocities of 127, and 4) the gentleman I spoke to at their US distribution said that Studiologic knows that it needs some more work and that it was released prematurely.

Frankly, I'd feel better coughing up the extra dough for a Kawai MP8II. 3 assignable pedal inputs, built-in sounds, and an action at least as good as that Fatar.

Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: jscomposer] #1378966
02/20/10 05:11 PM
02/20/10 05:11 PM
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 138
C
CruelStrings Offline OP
Full Member
CruelStrings  Offline OP
Full Member
C

Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 138
When I first read your review, I thought you were a hired reviewer by the competition, but now I realize you did some demos for Pianoteq, which
gives you credibility in my book smile

I believe you had a faulty device, because the other people I spoke to did not share the same criticism.
Did you end up getting a new model or did you get your money back?







Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: CruelStrings] #1378995
02/20/10 05:55 PM
02/20/10 05:55 PM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 537
The Boogie Down
jscomposer Offline
500 Post Club Member
jscomposer  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 537
The Boogie Down
Got my money back. Problem is I can't find it in stores. I'd have to order it again to prove one way or another if it was just a lemon. And like I said, the Kawai has an even better action, plus a full complement of 3 pedal inputs. More expensive, but perhaps worth it.

In my humble opinion, you're better off the their VMK-188. Same action but without the wood, 3 pedal inputs, and half the price. Though it's not clear to me that any of their pedal inputs support continuous data (like for half-damper effect).

Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: CruelStrings] #1444656
05/27/10 09:56 AM
05/27/10 09:56 AM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
S
stevesh1974 Offline
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stevesh1974  Offline
Full Member
S

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
It was mentioned that the VMK 188 uses the same action as Nero but in plastic. That would be the NUMA White. It has the same action as Nero but with plastic keys.

The VMK 188 uses the TP 40 GH. It's actually more like a Kurzweil PC3X (TP40L) or Nord Stage 88 (TP 40M)

If anyone wants to discuss actions, I am willing...

Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: stevesh1974] #1444705
05/27/10 11:13 AM
05/27/10 11:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 54
Czech Republic
pesk Offline
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pesk  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2009
Posts: 54
Czech Republic
White NUMA has TP400, Nero has TP40WOOD and Nano has TP100LR. Here is the link for Fatar's piano actions:

http://www.fatar.com/Pages/TP_40WOOD.htm

I had VMK188+ with TP40GH which is the same like TP40WOOD only with wooden key sides. Keyboard was very solid, nice keytrack, no squeking or wobbling like on Casio PX 330. But it has too hard touch for me and only one (linear) velocity curve. I had to adjust it in software but it was still too hard for me to play longer time. I've started to lose sensitivity in fingers. And also bottom of the key press was a little bit "woolly". If you've (CruelStrings) got a chance then test it first for more then 10 minutes.

As it was mentioned before, there is no instrument with TP40GH action - all vendors use ungraded versions of TP40...

Last edited by pesk; 05/27/10 11:15 AM.
Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: pesk] #1444836
05/27/10 02:56 PM
05/27/10 02:56 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
S
stevesh1974 Offline
Full Member
stevesh1974  Offline
Full Member
S

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
The Tp 400 and Tp 40wood keys are pretty much the same size (specifically: taller than other fatar keys). This increases key throw depth, which I believe is the main explanation for the nice feel of these actions.

I think they should have called the TP40/Wood... TP400/Wood. The black keys on both Numa White and Numa Nero are double molded with an ebony-like texture. All I'm saying is that the TP40Wood is more like the TP400 than being like other TP40 actions. The wood "sandwich" setup gives the Nero keys a more solid or dense feel, but also causes the return to be a little slower...which can be good or bad depending on what you're used to. No big deal...just an observation.

Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: stevesh1974] #1445068
05/27/10 08:47 PM
05/27/10 08:47 PM
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 35
California
P
pkdd Offline
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pkdd  Offline
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P

Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 35
California
Originally Posted by stevesh1974
It was mentioned that the VMK 188 uses the same action as Nero but in plastic. That would be the NUMA White. It has the same action as Nero but with plastic keys.

The VMK 188 uses the TP 40 GH. It's actually more like a Kurzweil PC3X (TP40L) or Nord Stage 88 (TP 40M)

If anyone wants to discuss actions, I am willing...


Hmm, I didn't know that about my PC3X keyboard. So TP40L is supposed to be light action? I don't think I'd want it any heavier. Does anyone have a sense of how the TP40WOOD feels in comparison? Lighter/heavier? (Obviously it's graded.)

Re: Fatar Numa Nero [Re: pkdd] #1453883
06/10/10 08:27 AM
06/10/10 08:27 AM
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1
G
groegaard Offline
Junior Member
groegaard  Offline
Junior Member
G

Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1
Hi guys,

Does anyone know whether Numa Nero will work fine under Windows 7 64bit?

Thanks!

corrections to my last comment [Re: CruelStrings] #1454919
06/12/10 12:39 AM
06/12/10 12:39 AM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
S
stevesh1974 Offline
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stevesh1974  Offline
Full Member
S

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 47
I was recently able to open up a Numa White (I had already done so with the Nero). The Nero keys don't fit on the White keybed frame. It is a very close miss though. So giving the keybeds very different model numbers makes more sense now.(TP40wood and TP400)...

Note: the Nero keys won't fit on any TP 40 frame either). Whereas you can interchange keys between just about any of the TP models (TP 23,30, 40...). I have done this many times when keys got damaged. Although there are slight differences in white key color at times (different shades of white and off-white).

Also, I was mistaken about the key surface on the black keys of the Numa white. The Nero has that nice textured fake ebony feel, while the black keys on the Numa white are pretty smooth.

For me the Nero just needs the faster key return of the White (simply a change of the type of return spring used...Fatar has many varieties), and for Fatar to file down the overhang on the inside corners of the white keytops.

Re: corrections to my last comment [Re: stevesh1974] #1455393
06/12/10 07:57 PM
06/12/10 07:57 PM
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,164
Sydney, Australia
S
sullivang Offline
3000 Post Club Member
sullivang  Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,164
Sydney, Australia
Here's some praise for the Studiologic Numa (is that the same as the Numa Nero?) from someone intimately involved in the development of the VAX 77, FWIW:

http://www.forum-pianoteq.com/viewtopic.php?pid=10627#p10627

Greg.

Re: corrections to my last comment [Re: CruelStrings] #1836548
02/01/12 03:28 PM
02/01/12 03:28 PM
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,014
canada
J
johnlewisgrant Offline
1000 Post Club Member
johnlewisgrant  Offline
1000 Post Club Member
J

Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,014
canada
Played a Numa at LandM in Toronto. Wanted an mp6, not for the sounds, but just the action. I'm a acoustic piano guy, playing on a Hailun 218. The numa action seemed pretty good, but I couldn't DIRECTLY compare to he Kawai, cause these guys don't stock it.

Numa or Mp6 or keep my cp33, which doesn't feel much like a piano at all to me.

What should I do??

JG


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