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Hi everybody,

I am new to this forum. I have really enjoyed reading the posts here. I currently own a Yamaha C2 (5'8"), but wish to upgrade soon to a larger piano.

I am only beginning my shopping and would like to know if there is a rule of thumb to determine what is the maximum length a piano should have in order not to sound too loud in a particular room. Our living room is 23 feet long by 16 feet wide and the ceiling height is 8 feet.

I am considering pianos with a lenght of around 7 feet. My current piano sounds OK, but I am worried that a longer one would be too loud.

Any advice on the matter would be most appreciated.

BTW : If it helped any suggestions, my budget is around $35K canadian... might be able to stretch up to $45K canadian, depending on my wife

This is a tough one. What's going to work for you?

My experience... Our livingroom is 17x33, low ceilings. I have a Steinway A3 6'4" and it's pretty awfully loud. Sometimes I wish I'd bought a smaller piano. If you're a listener sitting next to the open soundboard, it's a real BLASTER. OH, MY POOR HUSBAND

A smaller piano would have filled our space soundwise just fine, but a smaller piano means you'll compromise on tonal quality. It's a trade off.

Whether your piano is going to sound too loud to you also depends on the tonal quality of the type of piano you are buying. My impression is a Yamaha, for instance, has a slightly less robust, growly, burly sound than many Steinways. I'm thinking you can probably get away with a larger Yamaha than a comparably sized Steinway because the Yammie's have a somewhat lighter tonal quality????

Also depends on what kind of surfaces you have in your room. Lots of upholstery? Or mostly hard surfaces? This can have a dramatic difference in tonal quality, as I've witnessed. Surely must also affect loudness.

I'm not a tech, this is my unqualified reaction to your question. This question would probably best be answered by a technician. Hopefully some of them will chime in here to help you out.

Something else to consider, as has been discussed here before also, louder is not always better. Sometimes it just takes a while longer to appreciate a quieter instrument.

This is an exciting time for you! Play as many pianos as you can and then make your choice.

Jeanne W

Thanks a lot Jeanne W for your prompt response !

I have been told by many sales perons that even a 7'6" piano would be fine if I played it well... but I have been playing for a while now and figure that even 7 feet may well be too much.

To answer your question, there is a little bit of furniture... it is the "piano room".

I have already made a few appointments in Toronto to look at pianos around 6 feet but with a nicer tone than my current Yamaha C2 (the brightness si starting to get to me slowly...).

Thanks again Jeanne W for your comments!

A quality piano of any size can be regulated so as to produce just a whisper of sound, and provides control from piano to forte and beyond. Just listen to recordings of concert grands!

Paradoxically, it's the shortest, poorest quality pianos that are so out of regulation that you have to fling the hammer to the strings, so that your minimum volume is "loud".

Yes, a larger piano will have a larger maximum volume, but what you're looking for is control.

A different issue is the acoustic signature of your room. Is it carpeted with lush drapes, or a tile floor with plaster walls? This will greatly affect how your piano will sound, compared to the showroom.

--Cy--

Thanks very much for your post Cy Shuster,

You are not the first to tell me about the link between "better" control and actual "loudness".

BTW, the living room is carpeted. I should have mentionned it before...

The size of a piano is not the best indication of volume.
The small pianos, up to 5'8", I tried were all made to be loud and noisy to compensate for their size.
The only exception to this is supposed to be the Estonia 168, the one I tried did not seem quiet however.
I got a Kawai RX-2. it is 5'10" and got it voiced down.
Wish someone made a small quiet grand.
The alternative is digital. I could not find one I liked.

Thanks for your post CHAS. My dad got a RX-2 as well a few monhts ago. Lovely piano. He too had it voiced down a little.

Hi Prokofan, I just acquired an exquisite Steinway Hamburg C 7'6" and placed it in my living room which is 21' long by 16' wide with a celing at 20'6". The sound is magnificent.

I think the floor and wall coverings have a great deal to do with the sound-perhaps even more than the size of the room. I wouldn't necessarily be afraid of a larger piano.

Rick

Thanks Rstier.

Wow! What a beautiful instrument you have there... making me jealous here:) !

Hello Prokofan. I just welcomed into my home a 7 ft semi concert grand. My room is 23 by 16. I have hardwood floors and 2 leather chairs. I made the room to be the piano room as you have. The ceilings are vaulted and they peak at 14 ft.If a 9 ft would have fit comfortably, It would have gotten one. I believe it's all a matter of personal choice. For me the louder the better. Good luck on your piano search and keep us posted as to how it's going.

Thanks Prokofan,

I'm in love with this piano and very grateful to have it...it really is "Thanksgiving"!

Hi Snoman and thanks for your post

It looks like if most of you beleive that my room "could" accomodate such a large piano. I have to say that I might have to simply try it out, i.e., go to a dealer where I beleive I could potentialy buy a piano and ask to try a 7 footer-ish for a week-end. Whatever cost it may involve, it looks like if it could be a good investment in the end.

Once I have determined the size of my next monster, I will start the "real" shopping, and let you all know about the process. I sure want to ensure that I will be trying as many brands as possible (as many of you on this forum rightfully suggest).

I have a 6' 4" Grotrian in a 25x12 room with 7.5 ft ceilings. The room is VERY bright with hardwood floors, large windows(plenty of hard surfaces). I cannot play loud enough for it to be unpleasant. Never. I think if you like the piano you choose, you'll like the sound that comes out no matter how loud.

Unless the dealer would be willing to deduct the cost of rental of a grand piano for a weekend - if you eventually purchase from him - you might be surprised to find out just how much it costs to rent a grand for a few days. I seriously doubt that you'd get buy with less than $1000.00 for that experiment. The piano has to be prepared for delivery, delivered, setup, tuned, and then the whole process has to be repeated for the return. While "free delivery" might be part of a purchase agreement, you'll have to remember that part of the cost is the two-way delivery on this "trial" experiment.

Furthermore, you may be hardpressed to find a dealer who is going to let a new piano out of the showroom on a trial basis; if they do that, can they still sell the piano as new? It's not quite the same as keeping a piano in the showroom, is it? Dealers who do have pianos for rent, may not have a rental piano in the particular size you are looking to "test drive".

Regards,

My LR is about 13x24 with 19 ft ceiling and with an open floor plan (hardwood floors with area rugs)

I have a 225cm (about 7). I find it perfect but the reset of my family says it is too loud. I agree it is capable of a LOT of volume, however, they never remember the delicate sounds.

Our LR/piano room is about 13x17 with 8 foot ceiling. Our 7'4" piano is situated along the 13' wall, (not perfectly parallel and angled slightly into the room). The room is carpeted, has heavy drapes and furniture in it. Even with the lid fully opened, it doesn't rattle the house.
As a routine matter, we play the piano with the lid opened on the small stick and many times it doesn't overwhelm anyone trying to watch TV in the next room when played quietly.

Joel

For one thing, size really has little to do with loudness. As a general rule, the bigger the piano, the softer it can be played which all comes down to the controllability of the action due to the length of the keys in larger pianos.

Larger pianos can also be played much louder.

A couple of other things though.

1) It's impossible to predict how a particular piano will sound in a specific room. Examples:

a) I know of a 5' piano sitting in a huge living room with 9' ceilings that blows my eardrums out. It cannot be played softly. In fact, I won't even play it anymore it bothers me that much.

b) I have a concert grand in an area of approximately the same square footage as your room. It is not loud at all. Walk one room down and shut the door and it cannot be heard when played softly. I can also rattle my neighbors chandelier if I feel like it.

2) Assuming you are buying a good piano, it, and the room, can be voiced so that it is not overpowering by any means. I should also mention that this is where a good tech FOR THAT SPECIFIC BRAND of piano is SO important. The store technician may be fine, but don't count on it. Start lining up the names of other techs WHO KNOW THAT BRAND - I can't emphasize that enough.

3) Make sure the piano has a very definitive dynamic range in the showroom. If it does not, and you should need to voice it down when it is in your home, you may wind up with a "dull" sounding instrument. The piano should "sing" at very low and louder volumes. It should also change "timbre" depending on how hard you hit the note.

I would be much more concerned about the piano itself rather than the size of the piano.

Hope this helps,
Derick

My apartment's living room is 25x14, ceiling somewhere around 8-9 ft, wtih opening into a short hallway and dining area. The piano is 192 cm (6' 3-4"). The carpet covers about 80% of the room with wooden venetian blind on all windows. I don't think it is too loud and none of my neighbor complains so far, even when I practice late at night or early in the morning.

I am going to disagree somewhat with those would are suggesting you can compensate for the size of the piano with your technique. At one level that is undoubtably true, but it is quite frankly, frustrating to constantly have to adapt your approach to a piece to the power of the piano. I am not a particularily good player, but all of us must have some physical limitations in the amount of variance we, the player, can make in our touch. It is much more satisfying to be able to match fff to full throttle, than otherwise, and to always have the full range of 'throttle' available to you.

We have a 6'1" Knabe in about the same size of room as yours. It is a powerful instrument for its size (at least more so than Kawai or Yamaha). We generally play lid closed or short stick. Sometimes, for a bit of fun and with an empty house, I will go full stick. After an hour or so my ears are ringing and it is time to stop.

The only thing that I can maybe shed some light on for size of grand pianos is this.

In my limited experience, I have found that the larger the piano, and the more quality built, the more control I have for nuances AND for playing softly. The first time I played the new Mason and Hamlin CC 94 during the factory tour, I was more than amazed at how easy it was to control playing pp!

Others mistake a 'bright' piano for 'loud'.

It surely sounds to me like you have the room for a 7 ft plus in your room. Guess your style of playing and the piano make that you pick might come into play. (a pun!)

LL