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Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Dr Popper #1355309 01/22/10 07:24 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Popper
I could detect no velocity switching whatsoever on the CP1 or CP5 as I've previously said the only tiny thing I "might" have noticed was a slight artifact of some sort on the decay but I wasn't even 100% sure of it.


Originally Posted by Dr Popper

No discernible stretching or looping on the CP1 or CP5 like you would hear on almost any other Yamaha DP.


OK. Thanks. That's VERY encouraging.

One more (related) question - maybe two. How is the dynamic range / timbre change (from ppp playing to fff playing)?

(It seems to me that the folks who have played the CP1 (a) really like the sound of the AP's, and (b) really like the action. Both good points, but the above issues are pretty critical as well - at least for my style of playing.

Lawrence


Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355380 01/22/10 09:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music


One more (related) question - maybe two. How is the dynamic range / timbre change (from ppp playing to fff playing)?



Oh its excellent but Yamaha have had this down for a while. The MotifXS Xpanded CFIIIs sample was very good in this regard and the S90Xs's S6 patch was even better. They actually can take quite a high degree of finesse well in fact more then I would ever use. The smooth even graduations are typical of the S6 piano ... they do capture the essence of the S6 in this regard.

All that said it was a noisy room and I was so caught up listening for Dewsters sampling artifacts that my impressions might indeed be premature. But I can say I heard nothing but pure S6 ..good or bad (lets not start on how people think its too bright for its own good because for me its perfect) I can't actually think of much bad to say about it.





"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Dr Popper #1355430 01/22/10 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Popper
All that said it was a noisy room and I was so caught up listening for Dewsters sampling artifacts that my impressions might indeed be premature. But I can say I heard nothing but pure S6 ..good or bad (lets not start on how people think its too bright for its own good because for me its perfect) I can't actually think of much bad to say about it.

I agree, this is encouraging! Thank you Dr. for elaborating somewhat on your earlier observations, and thank you again for taking the time to perform these experiments!

I for one love a bright piano, and sure wish they had put the S6 patch in the CP50. *sigh*

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
dewster #1355689 01/22/10 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by dewster

I for one love a bright piano, and sure wish they had put the S6 patch in the CP50. *sigh*


I'm confused, apparently. I thought that the S6 was a darker piano - at least darker than than CFIIIs. (I seem to recall that's how the Yamaha videos described the S6 when the S90XS came out).

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
dewster #1355692 01/22/10 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by dewster


That's why the "I almost can't detect any velocity switching" line in the CP1 video didn't impress me much.


Wow. Does anything, every impress you, dewster?

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355706 01/22/10 06:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music
Originally Posted by dewster

I for one love a bright piano, and sure wish they had put the S6 patch in the CP50. *sigh*


I'm confused, apparently. I thought that the S6 was a darker piano - at least darker than than CFIIIs. (I seem to recall that's how the Yamaha videos described the S6 when the S90XS came out).


No I wouldn't say that at all. I'd say the CFIIIS is definitely a slightly darker richer tonality then the S6B both are richer then the G or C series pianos but compared to say a Steinway or another European board they both are brighter then a full moon. The S6 is a more even piano with the CFIIIS being very expressive in the higher ranges. I've been offered one or the other for my C7 when the new X models come out. Don't know if I really want to replace my C7 at all ... its lovely.



"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Dr Popper #1355711 01/22/10 06:43 PM
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In terms of brightness, how would the piano on the CLP370, for example, compare?

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355718 01/22/10 06:53 PM
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Couldn't say I've never played it. I've played a CVP-509 and its clearly got both S6 and a CFIIIS in there. Its hard to tell on Clavinovas with their rubbish speakers.


"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Dr Popper #1355731 01/22/10 07:14 PM
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Thanks. I'll just have to play the CP1 for myself, and decide! Can't wait, but apparently have to! (Hopefully soon. It's so hard when the GAS is building up!)

In any event, I assume that judicious use of the Bass/Mid/Treble knobs would moderate if too bright. (I'm thinking of for solo piano applications).

It's interesting. When play the V-Piano, I dial down the brightness a bit (using the color parameter). The range is -7 to +7, with default at 0 ). I typically adjust it to -2 or -3 and soften the hammers a bit. However, when I play back the recording, now I want to add back in some of the brightness!

So, when I play, and when I listen, I'm apparently hearing different things - in terms of brightness / tone color. Interesting, huh?

Last edited by Melodialworks Music; 01/22/10 07:16 PM.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355804 01/22/10 09:13 PM
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Its always the way for me too. When I hear myself play on stage and listen to the recording afterward it always sounds less muddy. I think its speakers nothing quite sounds like a pure connection straight into a DAW to capture a instrument.


"I'm still an idiot and I'm still in love" - Blue Sofa - The Plugz 1981 (Tito Larriva)
Disclosure : I am professionally associated with Arturia but my sentiments are my own only.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355844 01/22/10 10:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music

So, when I play, and when I listen, I'm apparently hearing different things - in terms of brightness / tone color. Interesting, huh?


What kind of speaker, headphone moditor setup do you have. I assume when you play the line out on the v-piano goes direct to monitor speakers or headphones. Then how do you play it back? Swap cables, have a mixer? Does the sound go through the exact same path? How about you, how far did you move. Monitors likely have a very small sweat spot.

How are you recording? If it were me I'd be recording the S/PDIF output.

If you are recording the line out then you are adding two passes through an interface box which has a few op-amps and a/d and d/a converters.

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
ChrisA #1355863 01/22/10 11:10 PM
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The recording is MIDI, so same speakers, same sweet spot, same everything. The sound source is the V-Piano itself. Can't much more "pure" than that!

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355895 01/23/10 12:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music
The recording is MIDI, so same speakers, same sweet spot, same everything. The sound source is the V-Piano itself. Can't much more "pure" than that!


Using sequencer software?
When the v-piano plays from MIDI-IN I wonder how it determines which patch to use. When you tweak the sound for playing live do you save the adjustments so thay can be used when using the v-paino as a midi tone generator or do the adjustments only apply to the keyboard? I wonder if the midi file has the program switch commands correct?

Last edited by ChrisA; 01/23/10 12:33 AM.
Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
ChrisA #1355910 01/23/10 12:38 AM
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Yep. Same patch, same settings. V-Piano's on board sequencer. That's my point. The actual sound is the same, but my perception changes.

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Dr Popper #1355921 01/23/10 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Popper
Couldn't say I've never played it. I've played a CVP-509 and its clearly got both S6 and a CFIIIS in there. Its hard to tell on Clavinovas with their rubbish speakers.


This is certainly one limitation of console style digital pianos. Once I (hopefully) have the CP1 in place, the next step will be to match it with the best (that I can afford) audio system. (Upgrade the monitors, at least).

I'm also considering getting something like IK Multimedia's ARC system (Advanced Room Correction System ) to tune my audio system.

http://www.ikmultimedia.com/arc/features/

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1355947 01/23/10 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music
Wow. Does anything, every impress you, dewster?

My cat does now and then. But that's about it.

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
dewster #1356059 01/23/10 06:18 AM
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There's only one thing a cat can do that impresses me and the less said about that the better....

Lawrence, I think it is your brain that is responsible for the different perception you have between playing/listening...My experience is that I am NEVER satisfied when I play but when I listen to the playback I often think it's better. And this is not just about the sonic performance but my playing too.

Steve


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Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
EssBrace #1356487 01/23/10 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted by EssBrace
There's only one thing a cat can do that impresses me and the less said about that the better....


Awkward!

Quote

Lawrence, I think it is your brain that is responsible for the different perception you have between playing/listening


Agreed.

Quote

...My experience is that I am NEVER satisfied when I play but when I listen to the playback I often think it's better. And this is not just about the sonic performance but my playing too.


I'm the opposite. I often will like the sound when I'm playing, but when I listen to playback, I don't like what I'm hearing.

Lawrence

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
Melodialworks Music #1356547 01/23/10 07:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Melodialworks Music

Quote

...My experience is that I am NEVER satisfied when I play but when I listen to the playback I often think it's better. And this is not just about the sonic performance but my playing too.


I'm the opposite. I often will like the sound when I'm playing, but when I listen to playback, I don't like what I'm hearing.

Lawrence


This topic would warrant its own thread in the piano corner. Are either of you up to starting one there. I for one would like to see how this discussion would develop.

Re: New stage pianos from Yamaha!
theJourney #1356800 01/24/10 01:55 AM
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I agree it is interesting as our perception alters between playing and then listening/reviewing...interesting also that the shift towards/away from satisfaction is in the opposite direction for Lawrence and me...I wonder what is typical?

Steve


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