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Originally Posted by Horowitzian
Boy this thread has taken some interesting turns. smile

I think what you meant was......... (take it, someone!)......

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Originally Posted by signa
i just notice this thread but didn't read all posting here. i just want to say 'Bye and Good luck' to you, Horowitzian! i kind of understand what you were going through and how you made the decision, which is probably the similar reason that i don't want to show up much here as well.

always remember you being a out spoken and funny guy here, and we did share some opinions during the Cliburn comp last year.

have fun elsewhere and good luck!


Read the whole thread. smile


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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Kreisler
.....My "day job" is a part-time jazz gig in the mornings!

Jazz in the morning??
New one on me....... smile


I can't stand hearing a violin before noon...dunno about jazz. laugh


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Yeah I'm curious about that jazz gig in the "morning"! Do tell...

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Originally Posted by Wizard of Oz
Just try to get some of the classical players here to learn to improvise, it's like pulling teeth with them!

Does it count if no jazz chords or progressions are used? If it doesn't, then I don't improvise! Never!


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Originally Posted by Horowitzian
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Kreisler
.....My "day job" is a part-time jazz gig in the mornings!

Jazz in the morning??
New one on me....... smile


I can't stand hearing a violin before noon...dunno about jazz. laugh


You must not have heard any good violinists...


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Originally Posted by Philip Lu
Originally Posted by Horowitzian
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Kreisler
.....My "day job" is a part-time jazz gig in the mornings!

Jazz in the morning??
New one on me....... smile


I can't stand hearing a violin before noon...dunno about jazz. laugh


You must not have heard any good violinists...


I doesn't matter whether it's a friend of mine or Itzhak Perlman...I hate violins before noon.


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Originally Posted by currawong
Originally Posted by Wizard of Oz
Just try to get some of the classical players here to learn to improvise, it's like pulling teeth with them!
And just try to get you to stop bagging people for playing the music they like to play! That's a bit like pulling teeth, too!


Hey if you are a musician, wouldn't it be in your best interest to learn all aspects of music? Composing and improvising are just as important if not more than sight reading.

I never said you had to improvise jazz, you can just as easily do it with classical. What do you think Mozart and Bach were doing? They were playing around with melodies and motifs and just happen to put it to paper.

If Mozart were alive today and you asked him to play one of his songs he'd probably do it slightly different each time. I bet he'd find it boring it play it exactly the same way each time, I sure as heck would!!

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Originally Posted by Wizard of Oz
Hey if you are a musician, wouldn't it be in your best interest to learn all aspects of music? Composing and improvising are just as important if not more than sight reading.

I never said you had to improvise jazz, you can just as easily do it with classical. What do you think Mozart and Bach were doing? They were playing around with melodies and motifs and just happen to put it to paper.

If Mozart were alive today and you asked him to play one of his songs he'd probably do it slightly different each time. I bet he'd find it boring it play it exactly the same way each time, I sure as heck would!!
*sigh*
I grow a little weary of pointing out to you that you are making huge assumptions that classical pianists do not improvise. They can and do. I do. My students do. I know many pianists who do. I know many teachers whose students do. OK? So stop talking as if you're the only human in the universe who can improvise, engaged in a heroic one-man crusade to bring jazz improvisation to the stunted pianists who only want to play Bach, Beethoven, Brahms and Bartok.

Why would you assume I haven't studied "all aspects of music"? Why would you assume I don't think composing and improvising are important? I'm a composer for goodness sake, and I think I can safely bet I was improvising long before you were born.

But do stop talking as if those who have no interest in improvising are unmusical. You have no interest in playing other people's music from the written page, or playing classical piano, but I'm not accusing you of being unmusical, or of anything - except arrogance.

Last edited by currawong; 01/12/10 06:26 AM. Reason: Edited to more accurately represent Wizard's position

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I share your feelings. I've decided to watch during a few weeks how things develop just not to make a decision in the heat of the moment.


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Quote
... You have no interest in playing other people's music, as you've said often.

Is that true Wizard of Oz? Are you solely a player-composer-improviser? Or do you learn some notated classics of 18th 19th 20th century, that sort of thing?
I'm curious in light of your passion re improvisation.


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Hey currawong, you seem to take it personally what I say about improvising. Who said I was addressing you? You'd better relax lest you have a heart attack!

From my personal experience the majority of the classically trained players have minimal skills in improvising because they haven't been taught. One of my jazz friends did an improv seminar for classical teachers and they were pretty much completely in the dark.

If you're a composer then let's hear some of your music. And your improvising. Don't be like Gyro and just talk.

If you've been improvising loooong before I've been born, then you must be a senior citizen by now.

And who said I have no interest in playing other people's music? I NEVER said that. Go through all my posts and find where I said that, or are you now putting words in my mouth?! Stop being so presumptuous. I play other people's music all the time.


If I'm arrogant for suggesting pianists learn how to improvise, then you're just hopeless.


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Originally Posted by Canonie
Quote
... You have no interest in playing other people's music, as you've said often.

Is that true Wizard of Oz? Are you solely a player-composer-improviser? Or do you learn some notated classics of 18th 19th 20th century, that sort of thing?
I'm curious in light of your passion re improvisation.


Canonie, that currawong guy is just putting words in my mouth. Check all my posts and see if you can find where I said that. As for the old classics, let's just say I've finished the highest level of classical training that's accredited here. I just don't play that music anymore. Jazz is where it's at for me.

Must be something in the waters with you Kiwis Down Under. =)

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For the record, I never slammed any genre of music. If classical is your thing, play your hearts out. I like jazz so that's what I play. If it's Elton John and Billy Joel tunes that float your boat, be my guest!

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OK maybe I did get a little steamed up. smile I recall you describing how you were classically trained, then in your twenties gave it up for jazz. I believe you said you no longer play classical repertoire, but if this is not so then I'll take your word on that, rather than trawl through all your posts. smile I actually agree with a lot of what you say in your posts - but I really get annoyed with your tone, which comes across as smug. If you were merely "suggesting pianists learn how to improvise" I doubt I'd have reacted. After all, I encourage and teach my students to improvise, as I mentioned. Your "pulling teeth" analogy didn't exactly imply a gentle encouragement, and it was also very patronising.

As for the line about improvising before you were born - I gathered from some of your previous posts that you were in your 20s or 30s. If you're more ancient than that, then I'm mistaken. smile
Originally Posted by Wizard of Oz
If you're a composer then let's hear some of your music. And your improvising. Don't be like Gyro and just talk.
I see no need to prove anything to you. No-one here at PW is obliged to prove to you that they are telling the truth. Believe me or not as you choose.







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Originally Posted by currawong
[quote=Wizard of Oz]

You have no interest in playing other people's music, as you've said often, but I'm not accusing you of being unmusical, or of anything - except arrogance.


You know what CURRAWONG, NOW I'M TICKED OFF. WHERE THE HECK DID YOU COME UP WITH ME SAYING I DON'T PLAY OTHER PEOPLE's MUSIC,
"AS I'VE OFTEN SAID"

SHOW ME 3 OR 4 POSTS WHERE I SAID THAT. OTHERWISE YOU ARE GUILTY OF LIBEL.

BASICALLY WHAT YOU ARE SAYING IS FALSE. WHAT DO YOU HAVE TO SAY TO THAT, IS THIS HOW YOU ATTACK SOMEONE? ANSWER ME.

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Hey, quit shouting - who's in danger of that heart attack now! smile

You said you don't play classical from the written music any more - in fact you don't play from the music at all. However, you do play jazz standards, not just your own improvisations, so I got that wrong, didn't I. Shall I edit it out of my original post?

Actually, it would probably be more accurate to say:
"You have no interest in playing other people's music from the written page..." Agreed?


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In case you didn't realize, jazz standards are written by people too.

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Of course I realise, that's why I added it and said "so I got that wrong" (about not playing other people's music).


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Hahaha...ok man, I've calmed down. I just don't take kindly to false accusations, as you yourself probably don't. Yes, I don't play from written music anymore. I may use lead sheets to learn a song, but once I know it I'll play it by ear.

I have no qualms about other people's music, I'm just not interested in classical anymore. All is forgiven.

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