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Here is my dilemma and hoping others will chime in. I have been following the structured approach, reading notes, and playing basic to medium pieces, but recently decided to go the lead sheet way. Everything looks fine... I know most of the basic chords you find in pop music, but my trouble is what to do with those darn chords!

Take a simple song (Mary Had a Little Lamb will do), which is in 4/4. My choices which I tried are:

1) Play the C major chord in the LH on every count (4 times), or variations thereof (once for the whole measure, or even roll the chords, like C E G E, or C followed by (E G) together three times, etc.).

2) Play a ballad style: on 1/8th notes, counting 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 &: C G E G E G E G.

3) Play Alberti Bass style.

What other basic styles do you use? Especially ones used in pop music (no Jazz to keep things simple). I know some artists develop their own styles which have their own flavor and sound, but I'm just looking for a good sounding style that fits with many songs.

Also, if there is a book on this or a good reference. I noticed most of the places that talk about lead sheets, fakebooks, play by ear, etc., talk mainly about the types of chords, but not the style you play with those chords.

Check out a thread in ABF I just bumped up on Pete the Bean's Pop Piano Pro and Take the Lead series. He teaches left hand patterns and easy improvisation for pop lead sheet reading.

https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...%20Hot%20Tips%20and%20M.html#Post1077352

Barb

Thanks for the link Barb. There is lots of info in there, and I hope to be able to go through that soon. For now, I'm just looking for some ideas from those who play from lead sheets, and want to see what everyone uses when they read off chords from a fake book, etc.

For fakebook reading, I occasionally add some stride. To make it easy, you can do a shell left hand stride. If the chord changes every 2 beats, plunk out that low root on beat 1. For beat 2, bring your left hand up to a higher two note chord consisting of 3 and 7. Then, repeat process for beats 3 and 4. Try it out on a couple of measures of your favorite pop tune. It adds some nice variety to a song.

This is great stuff! That's why I joined this forum.

Thanks for this info Barb. I was wondering the same thing. Any recommendations for Fake books?

Rob

Hi Rob,

I have a pop fakebook that I enjoy. It also has standards, show tunes. I think it is a very good deal for the number of songs in there. Here it is:

http://www.amazon.com/Real-Little-B...mp;s=books&qid=1256822520&sr=8-2

Barb

Also I think the same as Auggiedoggy. This is a great technique for the left hand.
I did send the slow blues left hand pattern a couple of days ago, set out in this style.
http://cisum.info/SlowBlues.pdf

Great! Thanks.

Rob

Cudo - Here I go again - saying the same thing I said to you in the Levine thread - "A picture is worth a thousand words".

Great Post!

Looking at these books, in addition to the one Barb mentioned. About to check out the shopping basket, unless someone should stop me


How to Play from a Fake Book - Michael Esterowitz; Paperback

How to Play from a Fake Book (Keyboard Edition) - Blake

The Real Little Best Fake Book Ever: C Edition - Hal Leonard

Beethoven: Fur Elise - Neil Miller Analyzed Editions: A Valuable Aid For Memorization And Understanding - Bonus: Excerpts From The Piano Lessons Book - Neil Miller;

Note by Note: A Celebration of the Piano Lesson - Tricia

Piano Girl: A Memoir - Robin Meloy Goldsby; Paperback

Practical Sight Reading Exercises for Piano Students, Books

Grand Obsession: A Piano Odyssey - Perri Knize; Paperback

Progressive Sight Reading Exercises: Piano Technique - H

Practical Sight Reading Exercises for Piano Students, Book 1

Music_in_Me, you're trying to do it
the way many jazz novices do it,
that is, learn from a lead sheet
--indeed, I tried to do the
exact same thing--but in my experience,
this is a completely wrong approach.

There are thousands of jazz piano
method books you can buy that will
take you through the steps, each
more mindnumbingly complicated
than the previous, so that you
end up playing something
that resembles jazz/popular piano,
that is, a bad version of what a
pro does. I tried to do this--wade
through 3 jazz piano method books,
as well as books on classical harmony,
counterpoint, etc.--but I didn't
get very far and gave up on all
book study. It was just too tedious
to plow through all of that material.
And it was not helping me one bit to
play by ear and arrange.

I finally decided that this was not
right, because it all comes down to
playing by ear. Why plow through
thousands of pages of complex theory,
when in the end you'll still have
to do it all by ear?

Trying to learn to arrange from a lead
sht. is doing it backwards. Lead
shts. are for advanced players who
can play by ear. You've got to
have a trained ear first, and the
way you get that is by improvising--
before you try to do anything else.

To improvise--you've never improvised,
I can tell, or you wouldn't be asking
this (you need yrs. of improvising
before you'd even think of looking
at lead shts.)--you sit down at
the piano (a digital is better for
this) and just dig in with both hands,
playing purely by ear, with no
thought of any kind of theory.
When you do this, all of your musical
experience--your classical training
(that is, Alfreds), all the songs
you've heard on the radio or on
recordings, etc.--is drawn on,
subconsciously, and influences what
comes out of the instrument.

Initially, you might be disappointed
by what you produce, because it
doesn't seem to sound like the pros--
indeed, it might sound terrible to
you, like an child pounding on the
keyboard. But try recording some
of it, say, a brief few seconds of
your improvising, and you might
be surprised that it doesn't sound
all that bad. Like anything at
the piano, improvising takes practice,
and over time you'll get better
at it and will gradually zero in
on the type of sound you want to produce.

Then you'll have a trained ear and
will be able to do other things, like
arranging, and playing from lead shts.,
etc. But more likely, you'll
forget about all that, because
you'll be playing your own music,
your own way, and that's so much
better than merely arranging someone
else's songs.

Deja vu, Gyro. Broken record?

Oh, shut the ___ up. If you don't want
to learn how to play, there are
others here who do.

I have How to Play from a Fake Book, I think it's the Blake Neely version rather than the Esterowitz but I'm not near it at the moment.

It was enormously helpful. I was able to use it in performance almost immediately (playing for church.)

There is a grain of truth in what gyro said, I think. And that is that for many of us, academic knowledge learned out of context does not transfer well to playing.

For example, I read through my wife's theory books and learned about triads in 12 keys, etc. But it made no sense until I played with a Praise and Worship band. Then I only needed one key, D, because that's all the guitar could play. But I needed to spell chords in inversions in real time, and theory hadn't helped me with that. (I know it does for some people)

Typically gyro has observed something and leapt to the wrong conclusion about the cause. It is not the knowledge that was wrong, but the application.

And no I can't improvise. I can play from a lead sheet though.

Any other styles out there?

So far, we have:

1) Play the C major chord in the LH on every count (4 times), or variations thereof (once for the whole measure, or even roll the chords, like C E G E, or C followed by (E G) together three times, etc.).

2) Play a ballad style: on 1/8th notes, counting 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 &: C G E G E G E G.

3) Play Alberti Bass style.

4) If the chord changes every 2 beats, plunk out that low root on beat 1. For beat 2, bring your left hand up to a higher two note chord consisting of 3 and 7. Then, repeat process for beats 3 and 4

Okay, I am far from being any good at this, but here are other ways I've tried for playing that chord from a lead sheet:

1. Alternate inversions on the beat. Example, CEG, move lower GEC, back up CEG, lower GEC, etc. Lots of variations possible.

2. Oompah. C, EG, C, EG.

3. Arpeggios at various speeds. C, E, G, E quarter notes. CE, GE, CE, GE. (eighth) CEGE, CEGE, CEGE, CEGE. (sixteenth)

4. A woman at my church did this particularly smoothly: C, C octave, above that G, E, C, Repeat.

5. boogie. C4, C5, E4, C5, G4, C5, C4. with a dotted rhythm.

6. root-fifth. C4, CEG4, G3, CEG4, C4, etc.

Thanks for the additions TimR.

I have a question: When you play using ballad style, it's easy to do 3-note major chords. For example, C E G, becomes C G E. But how do you handle other chords while in this style? If you hit A7 next, how should you play that? What I have been doing is just change it to a major A chord then open the chord as in the C example above.

Gyro, sounds to me that you needed guidance from a teacher. You cannot just automatically learn to play from a lead sheet. You obviously have to learn how. But to say you're just going to "dig in" results in what? You still have no guidance so you can still NOT play from a leadsheet.

Like anything else, it's not going to take two weeks to learn. You transfer your frustration at learning to every beginner out there.

Just for comparison, I learned to play a basic tune from a leadsheet within a few months of learning piano. Sure it took years to play in a more sophisticated way, but it could have occurred earlier had I received guidance.

And learning to play the tune from the leadsheet is a totally separate concept from doing a Jazz solo. Playing from a leadsheet is not that complicated. Soloing obviously is difficult.

In the recent threads I participated
in on this forum, various people
have posted links to a number
of pros playing on youtube, to
show "how it's done." Although
these players are very impressive
and polished, with many yrs. of
training, I personally would not
want to play like them. They all
tend to produce a similar sound,
probably because of the forces
in the jazz community who are
constantly trying to make jazz
uniform and standardized, like
classical music. What's the
point of playing like them?
They already all sound very similar,
so what you going to do, just add
another carbon copy to that?

I prefer to just dig in and play by
ear, always trying to reach for a new type
of sound. You study jazz theory books
and you're just going to end up sounding
like everyone else. I see no point
in doing that. In my view, you might as
well not play if you're just going to
sound like everyone else. So I
study no books and do it all by ear,
and if it sounds bad to the textbook
jazz players, that's just great,
because then I know I'm on the right
track. I don't sound like everyone else.

Gyro,

I would love to hear a demonstration of this "new type of sound". Could you please post a recording? A little evidence would go a long way toward countering any skepticism of your theory.