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RX-2 Millenium Edition #124113
10/11/08 05:19 PM
10/11/08 05:19 PM
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mister Offline OP
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My local Kawai dealer is selling a "RX-2 Millenium edition". (ME) This piano seems really amazing but I'm not sure if it's really all that much better than a regular RX-2.

I'm basically trying to choose between 2 pianos:

(1) RX-2 ME (millenium edition)
Pros:
-Fancy soundboard using Italian Ciresa spruce
-Sounds incredible to me, my teacher loves it too and says it sounds like a Steinway
Cons:
-8 years old
-$1000 more than a regular, new RX-2
-5 year store warranty
-Doesn't have millenium III action

(2) RX-2
Pros:
-Still pretty nice tone, although I don't like it as much as the Millenium
-Very good action
-Not sure if the keys are different from the ME, but they seem a bit easier to grip

Cons:
-When I play the ME and then go back to the regular RX-2 it sounds like junk (EDIT- ok, maybe junk is a bit strong- I just meant that even though they were nearly the same model, the difference in tone was big enough for me to have a clear preference)

The dealer made the ME sound amazing but I'm not sure how much is sales hype. As I said, I did think it sounded incredible, but I'm not sure if I am overpaying- it's $15k for a piano that's 8 years old and doesn't even have the Millenium III action.

Thanks!
-Mr.

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Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124114
10/11/08 05:27 PM
10/11/08 05:27 PM
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New York City
pianoloverus Online content
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You have to balance cost and how much you like the piano. Only you can decide this part. Sounds like you've already decided which piano you like most if cost was not part of the equation.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124115
10/11/08 06:06 PM
10/11/08 06:06 PM
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mister Offline OP
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Yeah, if cost isn't in the equation then I like the RX-2 ME the most. I'm just not sure if I'm a sucker for paying $1k *more* for a used piano and falling for the sales pitch about the special wood, etc.

I dug up an old thread where KawaiDon said:
"We have issued some special models with 'Ciresa' spruce (mainly the Millenium Editions). We were unhappy with the initial seasoning of the woods, though the tone was very nice."

I'm not really sure what particularly they were unhappy with- did the soundboards tend to develop cracks, or what?

Thanks again for all the advice everyone

-Mr.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124116
10/11/08 06:38 PM
10/11/08 06:38 PM
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Marty Flinn Offline
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A $1000 more for an eight year old RX-2 than the price of a new RX-2 that has the new action?
The only "wood" discussion relevant would be if it was in your head. Get the new RX-2 a great instrument!


Co-Author of The Complete Idiot's Guide To Buying A Piano. A "must read" before you shop.
Work for west coast dealer for Yamaha, Schimmel, Bosendorfer, Wm. Knabe.
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124117
10/11/08 07:16 PM
10/11/08 07:16 PM
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mister Offline OP
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Hmmm you may be right Marty!

I suppose it could be how that RX-2 ME was voiced but man I tell you honestly, based on playing the two side by side, the tone of the two was night and day. Everyone there agreed that it was superior (my teacher, my tuner, my brother, and myself).

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124118
10/11/08 07:31 PM
10/11/08 07:31 PM
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Posts: 21
Tucson
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energyguyoly Offline
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Hey Mister,

For what it's worth, I just came back from my Kawaii dealer. I've been looking at Boston vs. some smaller Kawaii's and Yamahas. I was just "offered" a new RX2 for $15,000 plus tax including delivery, tuning, reg, bench etc. I've read in the forums that when you find the right piano, you "fall in love with it." I did and the dealer knows that, and he still offered it at about $15,000 (here in AZ).

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124119
10/11/08 07:31 PM
10/11/08 07:31 PM
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energyguyoly Offline
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Hey Mister,

For what it's worth, I just came back from my Kawaii dealer. I've been looking at Boston vs. some smaller Kawaii's and Yamahas. I was just "offered" a new RX2 for $15,000 plus tax including delivery, tuning, reg, bench etc. I've read in the forums that when you find the right piano, you "fall in love with it." I did and the dealer knows that, and he still offered it at about $15,000 (here in AZ).

It's not the millenium edition but it does have the millenium action.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124120
10/11/08 11:38 PM
10/11/08 11:38 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
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California
koiloco Offline
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Listen to Marty.

Have the dealer prep the new RX-2 then compare again. Also, a new piano out of a crate won't sound as good as one broken in. Either way, get the new one.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124121
10/12/08 03:35 AM
10/12/08 03:35 AM
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Malaysia
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tanjinjack Offline
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I'll second koiloco.

Ask the dealer to prep the new RX-2 to be similar to the ME edition in tone. Go for the new RX-2 that is so attractive in price and has the new action and also the better warranty!

I think if anyone can tell the price for a new ME edition during 2000 would be an indication for mister to decide.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124122
10/12/08 04:15 PM
10/12/08 04:15 PM
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 1,371
Orange County, CA
KawaiDon Offline
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Mister,

In the Kawai pianos, the Ciresa spruce was more sensitive to very dry climates than the usual Kawai spruce from Canada. The Ciresa boards are slightly more flexible than the Sitka, creating a little sweeter tone that sustains well. If you live in a place with very dry conditions, using a humidity control system should protect the board from cracking.

If you are not unhappy with the action in the older piano, then it sounds like the tradeoff between tone and touch is a good one for you. But the advice others gave regarding asking the dealer to tune and prep the new piano is also good.

There are also differences from one piano to the next, so a different example of a new RX-2 might also please you as much as the Millennium Edition model.


Don Mannino, MPA
Kawai America
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124123
10/12/08 05:15 PM
10/12/08 05:15 PM
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masaki Offline
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mister,
Production of RX-<n> ME (millenium edition) has been discontinued a few months ago. As I know of, Kawai did not explain why they did so inspite demands for this edition seemingly existed.
It could be that this model did not produce more profit for Kawai than regular RXs or SKs. Another reason, I guress, is mechanical characteristics of Ciresa soundboard does not fit to the case, the bridge or some other part of the piano. I guessed so when I saw frequent posts on a Japanese bbs by an RX2ME owner. According to his posts, the pitch down(e.g., a few cents per week) continued for more than six months.
I would suggest you to ask the dealer if they can send techs to tune your RX2ME free as many times as necessary until the pitch down rate decreases to a certain amount(e.g., few cents per month).

--
an amateur

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124124
10/12/08 05:56 PM
10/12/08 05:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 353
New York City
SophieM Offline
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It does not sound like any of the above choices is "the one" for you. Unless your impression changes upon subsequent visitS , you may have a big case of buyer's remorse if you buy any of them.

The worst thing you can do is buy a piano that sounds like "junk" to you. If it's junk to you, it's junk to you -- doesn't matter if it's new or has a fancy action.

Why don't you keep looking and play some more pianos until a CLEAR winner emerges?

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124125
10/12/08 08:25 PM
10/12/08 08:25 PM
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mister Offline OP
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Thanks for all the great advice! I'll try asking the dealer if he can voice the new RX2 to sound like the other one.

That is great info on the Ciresa wood... I am planning to install a dampp chaser so hopefully the soundboard will be ok. The thing about the piano not being able to stay in tune is a bit scary so I'll ask the dealer about the tuning.

Hmm, that's a good point Sophie.. There's a bit of pressure to make a decision for various reason... The biggest one is that I have a guest coming to stay with me in a couple of days, after which I'll have nearly zero time to do piano shopping. I definitely don't want buyer's remorse though so I will make at least one more trip to the store to try out the pianos.

Thanks again all for the great info and advice,

-Mr.

EDIT: when I said 'junk', that was maybe a bit of an exaggeration. The sound of the "regular" RX-2 wasn't bad in absolute terms and I think I could be quite happy with that piano as well- I just preferred the ME by a large enough gap that when I played it and went back to the regular RX-2 I felt like something was missing

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124126
10/13/08 06:11 AM
10/13/08 06:11 AM
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Malaysia
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tanjinjack Offline
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Alright, good luck!

Keep us updated!

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124127
10/13/08 11:40 AM
10/13/08 11:40 AM
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 177
IL
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windsound Offline
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Just for your info., one of my friends recently purchased a new RX-2 at $13.5K, including two tuning, excluding tax & delivery.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124128
10/13/08 08:09 PM
10/13/08 08:09 PM
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mister Offline OP
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Thanks tanjinjack!

Cool, thanks windsound. I was offered the same price for the new RX-2

Anyway... I'm going back to that Kawai dealer tomorrow, I e-mailed him asking if he could do any of those things people suggested (extra tunings, voicing, etc) but didn't really get any response but we'll see.

I also found a private seller who is selling a 1991 Yamaha C6 for $15k. I'm not sure if the larger size (6'11) really means it's a better piano than a C3 or whatever, but at that price it does seem like a bargain.

Oh yeah, I also went back to try that KG-2A again over the weekend... Didn't like it at all, surprisingly. Can't figure out why I liked it the 1st time, maybe the flattery from the salespeople got to my head or something -_-

-Mr.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124129
10/14/08 12:39 AM
10/14/08 12:39 AM
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tanjinjack Offline
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Check out that C6. I love big-sized, you know!

Anyway, be sure to get a technician to check out a used piano if you are interested in it!

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124130
10/14/08 01:01 AM
10/14/08 01:01 AM
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mister Offline OP
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I saw the C6 today... actually it was quite nice!

Unfortunately after thinking about it some more, I don't think I can really fit that in my place.

Thanks for the tip about technicians, definitely wouldn't want to blow $15k on a dud.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124131
10/14/08 01:23 AM
10/14/08 01:23 AM
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tanjinjack Offline
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If it was nice, then try to see if you can fit the piano or not!
Try it by moving some furniture here and there!

It's wise to justify which piano you like the best regardless of price and other factors. Which piano do you like in term of tone, touch and appearance only?

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124132
10/14/08 01:20 PM
10/14/08 01:20 PM
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windsound Offline
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I recently purchased a C7 (you can see photos in my post) and actually I was chosing between a C6 and a C7.

As my opinion, C6 is something that RX-2 can not compare. Of course, a thorough check is a must for a used one.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124133
10/14/08 03:56 PM
10/14/08 03:56 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,348
Hillsboro Beach South Florida
Bear 1 Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by windsound:
I recently purchased a C7 (you can see photos in my post) and actually I was chosing between a C6 and a C7.

As my opinion, C6 is something that RX-2 can not compare. Of course, a thorough check is a must for a used one.
windsound,

Yes a Yamaha C6 {6'11"} and a Kawai RX-2 {5'10"} aren't comparable. Need to compare like model to like model.

Compare:
C1 and RX-1
C2 and RX-2
C3 and RX-3
C5 and RX-5
C6 and RX-6
C7 and RX-7

Congratulations on your decision to purchase a new Yamaha C7, a very nice piano.

Best of luck,

Bear


Barry J "Bear" Arnaut ♫
46 Years in the Piano Industry
Retired Kawai/Shigeru Kawai Regional Manager
(My posts and threads are my opinions only)
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124134
10/14/08 07:04 PM
10/14/08 07:04 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,409
Surrey, B.C.
Norbert Offline
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Quote
It does not sound like any of the above choices is "the one" for you. Unless your impression changes upon subsequent visitS , you may have a big case of buyer's remorse if you buy any of them.

The worst thing you can do is buy a piano that sounds like "junk" to you. If it's junk to you, it's junk to you -- doesn't matter if it's new or has a fancy action.

Why don't you keep looking and play some more pianos until a CLEAR winner emerges?
Good advice - with story to tell? :rolleyes:

Norbert wink


www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124135
10/14/08 07:58 PM
10/14/08 07:58 PM
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mister Offline OP
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100 hours of research and trying out pianos, 15 piano store visits, 2 visits to private sellers, $300 for gas and technicians, 50 pianos, 2 canceled deposits, and 21 forum posts later, I've finally bought the RX-2 Millenium!

This is really the piano that I fell in love with. Today I went back to the Kawai dealer to try it again to see if I really loved it or if it was just a fleeting infatuation... But everything I play on it sounds like this piano was made for it! Every single note is amazing and I just think, "this is the sound I've been looking for."

I almost lost it too, there was a bit of a drama... I went to the store and the guys who run the store told me I should sit down because they had some bad news. They told me that someone else had bought the piano over the weekend. I was so sad my whole chest was hurting from pain and I could only stare at the floor and couldn't even open my mouth or say anything.

I played a few notes on the new RX-2 (non-millenium) and thought ah, maybe I'd just get that one. It didn't thrill me like the other one did though.

Then they said there was a chance the guy might not be able to finance the piano though, so they made some calls and it turns out the other buyer fell through...

So long story short, they're delivering it on Friday laugh I'll put up some pics when it arrives.

I did ask them about some of the issues like soundboard cracking and they assured me it should be fine as long as I get a humidifier. I would have liked some more assurance like, "if you have any problems, we'll personally fly to italy and cut down a ciresa tree to make a new soundboard for you" but I can see why that would be a bit impractical smile In any case I'll definitely take good care of this piano so hopefully it won't come to that.

Thanks again a million times over to all the folks who helped me out!

-Mr.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124136
10/14/08 10:48 PM
10/14/08 10:48 PM
Joined: Jul 2006
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Hillsboro Beach South Florida
Bear 1 Offline
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Congrats mister,

Welcome to the ever growing family of Kawai RX owners. smile

That's the way to do it. Buy the one you like the most. I'm sure you'll have many enjoyable years of playing the RX-2 Millennium Grand piano with it's special sound board.

Regards,

Bear


Barry J "Bear" Arnaut ♫
46 Years in the Piano Industry
Retired Kawai/Shigeru Kawai Regional Manager
(My posts and threads are my opinions only)
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124137
10/14/08 11:15 PM
10/14/08 11:15 PM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,409
Surrey, B.C.
Norbert Offline
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Congratulations to a very nice piano! thumb

Quote
I almost lost it too, there was a bit of a drama... I went to the store and the guys who run the store told me I should sit down because they had some bad news. They told me that someone else had bought the piano over the weekend. I was so sad my whole chest was hurting from pain and I could only stare at the floor and couldn't even open my mouth or say anything.

I played a few notes on the new RX-2 (non-millenium) and thought ah, maybe I'd just get that one. It didn't thrill me like the other one did though.

Then they said there was a chance the guy might not be able to finance the piano though, so they made some calls and it turns out the other buyer fell through...
Sorry, but this one I can't believe for one moment.....it simply sounds too fishy and getting another RX 2 from the supplier shouldn't have been a big deal at any rate......

Perhaps I'm wrong, but the very same story has circulated in the industry for as long as I can remember.

It works everytime.... laugh

One thing that's suspicious here is that it's not the guy calling that "he can't get the finances" - something that's normally expected to be the case - but the store doing it....

Anyways, you're happy and got the piano you wanted for yourself: good choice!!

Norbert smile


www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124138
10/14/08 11:28 PM
10/14/08 11:28 PM
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mister Offline OP
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Thanks Bear and Norbert laugh

Yeah, it does sound like a fishy story I guess. They seem like really nice guys though so I really would like to believe that they weren't trying to trick me. Oh well, I was planning to buy that piano anyway so trick or not, I'm happy with it smile

-Mr.

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124139
10/15/08 12:41 AM
10/15/08 12:41 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 15,409
Surrey, B.C.
Norbert Offline
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Quote
I was planning to buy that piano anyway so trick or not, I'm happy with it
Great, my wife tells me same thing....

Norbert laugh laugh


www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642
Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124140
10/15/08 04:36 AM
10/15/08 04:36 AM
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Malaysia
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tanjinjack Offline
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Hey mister,

Congrats on your new piano. It is surely a great piano that makes you decide over a new RX-2 and a used C6. Do post some pictures.

In Chinese culture, there's one thing we call 'yuan', or in English best to translated as Fate. It's fated that you can get that piano and hence the person can't get to finance the piano. It's all about FATE. LOL!

Once again, Congrats! smile

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124141
10/15/08 05:28 AM
10/15/08 05:28 AM
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I really enjoy this forum, so maybe a belated little spanner in the works. frown I chose the RX6 over a Yamaha C6. The Mill 3 action did it for me. Yamaha sounded better.

However, since the piano arrived (it was voiced by the dealer, regulated as well) and settled in, it developed the same beautifull overtones that I liked on the Yamaha. So it would seem as if the instrument has settled in, and also seems to "develop" with my playing and sound preferences as time goes by. It was tuned for the first time 2 weeks ago, and was rather "clonky" afterwards, like to much decay.

However, I persevered, and right now it is perfect. Gone is the sudden decay, and it is mellowing beautifully.

I have no doubt that the RX2 would have improved markedly over the RX2 M, after awhile, and with good voicing. And off course the Mill 3 action just seem to help you along. You think of doing something, and it just does it.

Congratulations with the new instrument. This is my second Kawai, and no no no, I will not have anything else! smile

Re: RX-2 Millenium Edition #124142
10/15/08 12:05 PM
10/15/08 12:05 PM
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California
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lol Deon, don't forget about the SK7 smile

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