Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2.5 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Piano Forums & Piano World
Find a Professional
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Advertise on Piano World

What's Hot!!
Welcome PianoTV members!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Piano Buyer Guide
Piano Buyer Fall 2017
Pierce Piano Atlas

Who's Online Now
119 registered members (ando, Adypiano, Almaviva, anotherscott, Anita Potter, amad23, 26 invisible), 1,387 guests, and 2 spiders.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords & Scales
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
#1220771 - 06/21/09 09:02 PM first post. Hand independence exercies??  
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2
armstrom Offline
Junior Member
armstrom  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2
I have a pretty basic question for you more experience players out there. I'm trying to work on getting a left-hand bass pattern going while playing a basic right-hand part on top of it. I'm having that common problem of not being able to keep my left hand pattern going once I add in the right hand. I tend to do well when all the left-hand notes coincide with with a beat on the left hand. My trouble is dealing with a different rhythm on both hands. Such as when playing a basic shuffle pattern or more complex boogie patterns in the bass.

I know one way to work around these issues is to just find the coincident beats between the right and left hands and use them as a "skeleton" around which to locate the rest of the notes that do not match a note on the other hand. I used this method to learn the main part of Ray Charles' "What'd I say" for example. However, what if I don't have a particular piece in mind? I would like to be able to just improvise a lead or comp some chords in the right hand over a standard bass line. I see videos of people doing this all the time online. They'll play the same melody over all sorts of different bass lines. I can't imagine they practice the same melody with all those different bass lines.. so what's the secret? Are there any exercises that can help eliminate the "cross contamination" between the right and left hand? I seem to practice the left hand patterns until I'm blue in the face but can't keep them together with the right hand..

Sorry for the long-winded question! I look forward to any advice from the forum. Thanks in advance!


Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#1220773 - 06/21/09 09:14 PM Re: first post. Hand independence exercies?? [Re: armstrom]  
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 104
Blues Babe Offline
Full Member
Blues Babe  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 104
Everett, WA
Matt: Though I'm far from being an experienced player, I'm dealing with this same issue right now. It seems to me that if one just keeps practicing different pieces in the manner you've identified (find the coincident beats between RH and LH and use them as a "skeleton" around which to locate the remaining notes that don't match a note on the other hand), eventually that skill will transfer into being able to improvise/comp chords in the RH over a standard bass line. Anyone out there have this experience, or am I dreamin'?

Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life.
#1220790 - 06/21/09 10:19 PM Re: first post. Hand independence exercies?? [Re: Blues Babe]  
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 150
Pianos_N_Cheezecake Offline
Full Member
Pianos_N_Cheezecake  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 150
Saskatchewan, Canada
Hey, Matt. My prof at University is brilliant so I am going to pretty much regurgitate to you a useful tool he gave me. He introduced me to something he calls rhythmic meditation (this is mostly for improvisation purposes but it works the same with melodies). It is the coolest thing. He told me to take a bassline (something in odd meters for advanced players) and play it in my left hand over and over and over again. Once I thought I had it down he told me to play it over and over again some more. He said after about 5 minuts I would be bored and very distracted but to remain focused. After 10 minutes I would be thinking "I can't play this bassline 1 more time" but to acknowledge and dismiss every thought from my mind and focus on the bassline. After 15-20 minutes I would start to go into a relaxed musical and meditative state, which I did. Once I got to that point he told me to start to play simple chords, then add lines, add some melodies while continuing to meditate on the bassline. And then, just let the music go... He said he would improvise for hours on the same chord progression/bassline. A big lesson I learned this past year was about how well I play vs. how well I know a tune. My prof sometimes asks me "You know this tune, but do you REALLY know this tune?". This is a way to REALLY get to know something well. The same excercise can be applied to different things like practising left hand voicings while improvising.


***Note: Be sure to maintain good posture while doing this excercise as if keep you more focused and you won't fall asleep!

#1220989 - 06/22/09 11:19 AM Re: first post. Hand independence exercies?? [Re: Pianos_N_Cheezecake]  
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,458
etcetra Offline
1000 Post Club Member
etcetra  Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: May 2008
Posts: 1,458
Piano N Cheesecake's advice is great.. I just wanted to add few more things.

The way you practice independence is not that much different than classical.. you might want to work on the two hands separate before you combined them. You will have to decide what your RH&LH does first.. like doing arpeggios, but make sure you work the two hands separately until you have them perfect effortlessly. After that combine the, at a very slow tempo, and gradually speed up as it becomes comfortable.

After that try different ideas on RH or LH, but only change one of hand at a time.. you'll notice that some ideas come out easier than others.. its the ones you're having difficulty with that you need to work on.

Also remember that this is a slow process.. it might take days, even weeks for some things to sink in.. so don't be discouraged if you are struggling with something after couple of days.

Last edited by etcetra; 06/22/09 11:21 AM.
#1221890 - 06/23/09 11:44 PM Re: first post. Hand independence exercies?? [Re: etcetra]  
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 7,203
jazzwee Offline
7000 Post Club Member
jazzwee  Offline
7000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 7,203
So. California
It probably took me a year to be able to walk bass and improvise at the same time. But it was very basic. And it was hard to keep the time solid. I don't do much bass walking now when playing solo piano so I'm not well practiced in it (not my thing stylistically) but I remember it took maybe 3 years before I could vary the left hand while improvising (instead of executing a memorized LH pattern).

It seems to operate with constant exchange of priority of brain control of LH and RH with the subconscious taking over briefly on the unattended hand. At least that is my perception of it. Like each part of the brain stealing time from the other but at brief intervals.

Pianoclues.com for Beginners
My Jazz Blog
Hamburg Steinway O, Nord Electro 4 HP

#1222200 - 06/24/09 01:51 PM Re: first post. Hand independence exercies?? [Re: jazzwee]  
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2
armstrom Offline
Junior Member
armstrom  Offline
Junior Member

Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 2
sorry it took so long to reply..
Thanks so much for all the great replies! I'll be sure to give those techniques a try. Just to give you an idea of where I'm at now here's a recording of a little improvisation of Hit The Road Jack in D...


This is an example of a left hand part I don't really have any issues with. It's simply walking down from D to Bb. It's slightly "percussive" (at least that's what I call it) but not quite as complex as some of the boogie bass lines. However, it took me about a week of off and on work (about half an hour a day) to get to where I could improvise the ending of the song. Even with that, you can tell my timing is quite a bit off in places. I ended the recording pretty quickly because it started going down hill fast smile

Moderated by  sharpsandflats 

Piano Acc. & Gift Items in
Piano World's Online Store
Save Big In our online store now

In PianoSupplies.com ,(a division of Piano World)
our online store for piano and music gifts and accessories, Digital Piano Dolly, party goods, tuning equipment, piano moving equipment, benches, lamps Caster Cups and more.

Free Shipping* on Jansen Artist Piano Benches, Cocoweb Piano Lamps, Hidrau Hydraulic Piano Benches
(*free shipping within contiguous U.S. only)
Maine Coast Music Vacation for Adults
Pearl River & Ritmuller
Ritmuller Pianos
PianoTeq 6 Out now
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Interesting eBay / CL finds
by Colin Dunn. 01/22/18 05:40 AM
Amateur piano competition
by Kenny Cheng. 01/21/18 10:22 PM
What's happening with Keith Jarrett?
by Dfrankjazz. 01/21/18 09:22 PM
What are some sites that sell used piano in europe?
by James Guo. 01/21/18 08:21 PM
Body movement at the piano
by chasingrainbows. 01/21/18 06:46 PM
Forum Statistics
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Sanderson Accu-Tuner
Check It Out!
There's a lot more to Piano World than just the forums.
Click Here to
Explore The Rest of Piano World!!
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |

copyright 1997 - 2018 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.6.0