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OH:) It doesn't matter to me. I was just amazed. Thanks for the clarification.

USD3000 (S$4406) for a reconditioned piano ??
I would rather buy a brand NEW good china-make piano.

No problem. I should apologize actually for my previous response to you. It may have come across as being kind of prickly. It wasn't intended that way!

wiltam,

I have PM you

USD3000 (S$4406) for a reconditioned piano ??
I would rather buy a brand NEW good china-make piano.


NW, a reconditioned piano from Japan. I had personally check on the condition of it of new hammerheads, new springs, and all materials are from England.

Honestly a brand new china make piano had so many problems and you end up on repairing. The china pianos are cheap indeed but they do not have any quality control on the product. Question is would you buy something value for your money and the difference in Japan and China quality.

In addition, most of these recondition piano of Yamaha and Kawai are actually a high demand for southeast asia market

Hi Max,

Your claim that Chinese made pianos "do not have any quality control on the product" is very surprising. You cannot say this about all Chinese pianos. And I think you know it.

There are many many piano manufacturers in China, ranging in size from the small cheap and nasty operations to very large and respectable manufacturers like Hailun and Pearl River. Hailun (who also make Wendl & Lung) pianos for example are of sufficiently high quality that some high-end piano dealers in the U.S. also carry them along with other tier 1 pianos. I'm sure that these dealers would not risk their reputations by carrying shoddy product.

Please be careful with what you say and make sure that you don't create unnecessary and unwarranted fear, uncertainty and doubt.

As for new hammerheads, new springs and materials being from England, I hope you are not suggesting that these things alone mean that a particular piano is in good condition. What about the soundboard, pin block, strings, regulation, voicing, etc?

I wonder if you are a piano dealer. Your posts suggest that you could be. If you are indeed a dealer then the forum rules require you to state your business name and brand affiliations in your signature. See HERE.

The made in china pianos nowadays are so different from some of the older ones like XingHai
At least the price is good to help a budding pianist starts up , ya ??

Hi everyone, am new here and this is my first post. I'm looking for information on the Cramer pianos sold here. Are they made in the UK by Kemble? (since they were bought over in 1964)

What's your opinion on their quality (the price range includes the Kawai K8 and Yamaha YUS5)?

For those who bought one, are you happy with your purchase and their after sales service, etc?

thanks !!

A high demand doesn't mean that it's good right?
And why is it high demand in SEA market only?

Well, my guess most of the customers here are ignorant enough and do not know how to compare. They have no knowledge on piano and practically trust whatever the dealers say, especially when dealers spend some tactics on it.

I met those dealers before, trying to trick you, telling you everything good about the piano, but fail to give me an answer when I asked for a permission for technician checking up. And hey, what are you afraid of? Answer: Smart customer.

You see how many people in SEA, and only how many of them actually post here. Check the traffic, there aren't many visitors as well I believe.

I agree with Digitus, you do sound like a dealer.

Hi TCH,

Welcome to PW!

The Kemble Piano Group in UK makes some Yamaha models for Europe. See HERE. They also own in-house brands, of which Cramer is one. All new Kemble models most likely have exact Yamaha equivalents. That's hardly surprising considering that Yamaha owns 60% of the Kemble Piano Group. Where Kemble pianos may differ from Yamaha would be in the cabinetry. Everything else inside is mostly the same, though there *may* be soundboard differences, but I don't know for sure.

Digitus and Tanjinjack,

This is a forum. I am just expressing what is actually happening in real life. I know it is hard to critise people especially mentioning that i could be a piano dealer. It makes no point for me to prove myself. All i know that i am not yet i am trying to help people to get the price and the quality of the pianos. I had good network with some of the great piano manufacturers and factories in both Malaysia and Singapore.

Hi Max,

What is happening in real life is that piano dealers are not helping to properly educate the piano buying public. There is a lot of misinformation and downright lies and bad-mouthing. If you know more about pianos then you should not be making claims, for example, that made-in-China pianos do not have any quality control. That kind of comment is not helpful because it is not true of all Chinese manufacturers.

Yes this is a forum, and you can say whatever you want. Nobody is stopping you from doing that. All I am asking of you is that you help educate rather than confuse and misinform.

By the way, which piano manufacturers have factories in Singapore and Malaysia? I had no idea that there was any piano manufacturing going on in either of these two countries.

ai yo yo ...
Nothing wrong being a dealer mah. Why you all like to swan Max saying he must be a dealer ?? hehe i'm not taking sides.
Just that, Max, if you say china piano have no QC, its good you can provide some example, so that we all can learn.

I have encounter 1 new piano china soundboard cracked rib personally before but i won't say all are like that. Of course i was puzzle and frustrated at that time cursing what the &$%#@^*$xxxing QC ?? Uneven damper spring rate #$^#$&^%^*@ etc

But that's just 1 bad egg i come across. I also heard from other tech some of the encounters they had. I just listen and learn.

Max, i like to welcome you to the forum to share more encounters you have experience with us if you don't mind. I'm open to all information. I'm sure some of us here can benefit from your sharing too

I'm sure you have you're reasons. I too are a bit wary of the rabbit, shanlu mike, mercury paint, all the funny things china do.... hehehe

yayayapapaya, i also heard before. last time in singapore arrr, there is 1 piano manufacturer. But now have meh?
Malaysia more fantastic. Is it Challen? I read about a guy who is very keen in making pianos, is it in penang? I really admire the determination and entrapunership!!!

Hello hello TanJinJack

Aiyo.. waiting for you to jio me go KL to do some pianoshopping for you.. hehehe
Well have you sercretly got a Hailun grand 178 already ?? ar??

I wasn't saying that being a dealer is bad. It's just that most of us have had less than enjoyable interactions with many local dealers. I apologize if my previous posts @ Max came across as being hostile. It was not intended to be, if you see the smileys at the end! I'm sure that all of us would welcome constructive and educational input from a piano dealer.

It would certainly be fantastic if Max with his extensive connections can help us cut through the BS.

Ultimately there is no substitute for thorough self-education.

Yeah

Basically, when comparing china piano,
one cannot say all are like cherry QQ
(some say HDB multistory carpark also cannot go up
But it's damm cute, like a Garfield cat face

I only know '92 Honda civic VTEC are highly demanded
the 3 door too, looks like a shoe.

:D:D

i can hear someone else giggling too ...


often ppl ask, if i hv $3000
which piano should i buy?

I'd say buy a $300 piano
use the $2700 to buy a good teacher(Hanon and Chezny fan type) for a year.

After that $8000(bonus of from secret account) will appear automatcally.
Now the quest is U1 or K5??


hahaha
joke only

Yes, some of the Challen is made in Malaysia. The price is not cheap as well. Last time I see is about RM15,000, even more expensive than Hailun!

http://musicalproducts.asiaep.com/musfac.htm

Not sure it's where though.