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I was wondering, is Bosendorfer really the best made pianos? There are so many famous reputable artists who claim that a Bosendorfer has the best sound. I believe Bosendorfer is the only company with the highest priced pianos and apparently they 'customize' it for you in their factory. When you place an order you can choose how you want the piano and then you need to wait until it is made and delievered (unless the one you want is in stock at a store).
Does any one have any thoughts on that? Their website explains their procedure of making pianos and they are quite specific on what they do. They definately have been around of over 150 years.
Michael Klein Willis & Co. (MFD: January 1915) & Yamaha YDP-121 (MFD: 2001)
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They are definitely first class pianos, and whoever tells you they're not, then they're probably lying to you or they're jealous because they don't own one. I've only played one Bösendorfer, but it was SO beautiful, so charming, so delicate... I fell in love with it. I think there's no "best" piano out there, this has been longly discussed. Some would claim Steinways are the best, others would go for Bösendorfer, others for Fazioli, Steingraeber, and so on... They're incredible, but there's no ultimate truth about which is the "best" piano out there.
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I remember when I was young, my mother tried to trade me, my two brothers, and my father in for a used 6' Bozendorfer at a store in Charleston, SC. It was forgivable, because the piano was apparently pretty fantastic. But I never got to play on it.
The one I've played on, which I think was a 9' (it was at least 7', but I'm not sure if it was the largest, it was years ago) at Elon University in NC was pretty great. The thing hadn't even been serviced in awhile, and was slightly out of tune, but the tone that came out of the low end was pretty amazing.
HOWEVER, I've played a better sounding piano. At a church down in High Point, there is a 7' Mason & Hamlin that is pretty old (1930's?). The action is complete mush, but the sounds that come out of it are out of this world. I would take that piano in a hearthbeat and spend all my spare change to make the action playable again. I would sell a Bozendorfer so that I could buy that M&H and fix it up.
I also have a local BIG BOX piano dealer who has had a C-3 (Yamaha) on their floor for 2 years now that sounds better (tone-wise) than their C-5 and C-6.
So, it's all about what you like. Bozzies are nice, but I think I'm in love with a M&H.
Retired piano salesman of 29 years. Favorite Brands: Yamaha, Mason & Hamlin, August Forster Owns: Yamaha C3
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MikeK: I was wondering, is Bosendorfer really the best made pianos?Not only that, but the best-sounding too. Not that I am in the least bit biased, obviously -Michael B.
There are two rules to success in life: Rule #1. Don't tell people everything you know.
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I was wondering, is Bosendorfer really the best made pianos? I agree that there is no best piano. However if you take the time to really look at how a Bosendorfer is made, and all of the extra things that they do to make a wonderful piano, then it surely is one of the very best pianos. The very best pianos have many very special things in the design and hand made construction which make their pianos clearly superior. Bluthner, Stiengraeber, Fazioli, and Bosendorfer do so many things that Steinway other fine piano companies do not do. They have such wonderful actions, such wonderful construction, such beautiful finishes, etc. that any of these will give the owner the satisfaction of owning a tremendous piano. And there are other pianos such as a Steinway B, or Feurich 227, or Grotrian Charsis, or others which will give the same satisfaction to their owners. For those who can play the best and own the best then there are a few pianos to chose from.
Bluthner, Steingraeber, Pleyel, Hailun, Kemble, Baldwin, Story and Clark, Pearl River, Ritmuller and others (store owner)www.encore-pianos.com
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Sound preference is highly subjective. I would say that there is no doubt that the Bosendorfer sound is "unique". Whether this translates into better (or the best) is really up to the listener. They are very well made, however a statement such as the "best made" is nonsensical.
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Bluthner, Stiengraeber, Fazioli, and Bosendorfer do so many things that Steinway other fine piano companies do not do. Please be specific. Thanks,
Marty in Minnesota
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I think he means the fanatical attention to detail with regards to the selection of the most select materials and execution of each step involved during the manufacturing process.
G.Fiore "aka-Curry". Tuner-Technician serving the central NJ, S.E. PA area. b214cm@aol.com Concert tuning, Regulation-voicing specialist. Dampp-Chaser installations, piano appraisals. PTG S.Jersey Chapter 080. Bösendorfer 214 # 47,299 214-358
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I mean more than the fanatical attention to detail. A Bosendorfer uses keysticks which have several layers of the finest woods which are assembled in different grain direction. This gives more aging and humidity stability as well as more strength than most keys. The way the rims are made and the extra materials that they use in the making of the pin blocks are just a few of many things that Bosendorfer does.
Bluthner uses a much more costly and labor intensive crowning process for their soundboards. Plus they use aliquote stringing and so very beautiful finishing of the outside of the pianos, as does the other Tier 1A brands.
Fazioli uses unique designs and the most wonderful materials. They have unique action designs and such as well.
Steingraeber uses the most modern designs and the most amazing new piano designs as well as the most time consuming production. (Each piano is tuned and regulated for 9 months after it is made and before it is shipped so that the wood will age and stabilize.) The new Phoenix Steingraeber will change the future of piano production.
The truth is that each of these piano companies has devoted great resources to improve their pianos over the last 5 or 6 decades. Meanwhile companies like Steinway keep on making the same piano designs that they made 90 years ago.
I believe that the piano was not perfected 90 years ago nor 10 years ago. I think that companies are proving, like Mason and Hamlin and their new action parts, that the best pianos are yet to be made. Even Petrof and their new magnetic actions are showing that better pianos are now being designed and made.
Pianos are made from more than 10,000 parts. And the very best pianos are made from the very best materials, the greatest production precision, the most hand work care, and the very best new designs. The best pianos from 1850 were nice. Pianos from 1900 were much better. And the very best pianos from 2009 are even better. I do not believe that some pianos from the "golden age" are the very best. Put a Steinway or old Chickering next to the very best new piano that I have mentioned and chose for yourself.
Bluthner, Steingraeber, Pleyel, Hailun, Kemble, Baldwin, Story and Clark, Pearl River, Ritmuller and others (store owner)www.encore-pianos.com
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Mike, there is a set of recordings of Grieg performed by Eva Knardahl on a Bosie Imperial under the BIS label. I realize that there will be differences between a recording and a live performance, but they sound wonderful and can give a nice impression of what a Bosie can do.
Dan
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Wow, great advice. Over all I get the feeling that Bosendorfer is really a great company to purchase from. I will definately check out the recordings. Anybody else have opinons on Bosendorfer?
Michael Klein Willis & Co. (MFD: January 1915) & Yamaha YDP-121 (MFD: 2001)
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I asked Bosendorfer to put a transfer of the Imperial Austrian eagle on the music desk of my piano while it was still in the factory. They happily did this at no extra charge. A nice touch. John
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Be fair to yourself. Play every piano you can get your hands on. You may indeed come away with the opinion that Bosendorfer is the best piano out there. However, you can't judge something as superior without judging it's competition.
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I listened to GianLuca Luisi play live at our piano shop, on a 9.6 Imperial Bosendorfer. I will agree with the beautiful sound of the Bosendorfer. One of the best I've ever heard. It's notes were very clear and powerful, bass through treble - after the show I played on it a bit (as well as the Vienna model) I was impressed with the Fluidity. I love this because a lot of pianos i've played are stiff, resist against the fingers, and are too "muffled" like your playing under water. drives me crazy. Definitely worth the $$, in my opinion.
Music is in the Heart, not the hands.
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Before buying my 225 I played a number of wonderful Tier 1 instruments. I bought the Bosie, not because it was the "best brand" but because that particular instrument was the one I liked best. I do agree with Gary that Bosendorfers are wonderfully made (the care that goes into them is tangible not just in terms of tone and touch but is obvious from looking). Steingraebers are also out of this world.
Bosendorfer 225 Bluthner Style 9 (Model 4)
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The truth is that each of these piano companies has devoted great resources to improve their pianos over the last 5 or 6 decades. Meanwhile companies like Steinway keep on making the same piano designs that they made 90 years ago.
Gary, Is it really true that Steinway has not been changing for so many years. I believe they do still improve their pianos, or else they shouldn't be able to survive after so many years. Anyone with thoughts on this?
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The truth is that each of these piano companies has devoted great resources to improve their pianos over the last 5 or 6 decades. Meanwhile companies like Steinway keep on making the same piano designs that they made 90 years ago.
Gary, Is it really true that Steinway has not been changing for so many years. I believe they do still improve their pianos, or else they shouldn't be able to survive after so many years. Anyone with thoughts on this? No, it's not entirely true. You put a B made last year next to a B from the 1950's and you'll be able to find quite a few changes just from a visual once over. I believe that the newest B's have revised bridges. It definitely improved that model. I cannot speak for the other models other than I believe the D needs absolutely nothing in the way of "improvement".
Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.
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interesting - my impression of the many Bosendorfers I've played is that they are "muffled". I cannot draw the sound out of them like I can with other brands. Perhaps it is their softer rim? They are a nice piano otherwise. I do like their actions.
I'm also interested that many here feel Steinways are "overpriced". A friend of mine just purchased a black polished ebony Bosendorfer 7'4" for $90K US (list price $119K). That is about $15K more than the LIST price of a Steinway B.
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It should be interesting to know that the word "best" is hardly ever attributed to any product today by modern Germans in Germany itself.
There is no "best" car, "best" piano, "best" beer or "best" cake.
It's all good stuff and everybody knows it.
By the way,for a very long time.
Perhaps this is not necessarily the same in every other part of the world...
Norbert
Last edited by Norbert; 03/06/09 02:31 AM.
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Norbert: It should be interesting to know that the word "best" is hardly ever attributed to any product today by modern Germans in Germany itself.Which of course is hardly relevant to the discussion at hand, given that Bösendorfers have always been made in Austria. Or is Vienna (along with perhaps Zürich?) considered to be part of Germany these days? Michael B.
There are two rules to success in life: Rule #1. Don't tell people everything you know.
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Piano
by Gino2 - 04/17/24 02:34 PM
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Piano
by Gino2 - 04/17/24 02:23 PM
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