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HANON study group #1124421
06/07/06 02:24 AM
06/07/06 02:24 AM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Intro

This is the Hanon study group for beginner and intermediate piano players (see the original thread leading to this group here ). The purpose of the group is to share our experiences and ideas when practicing these exercises as well as providing some motivation for each other. Although the group is for beginners and intermediates, everybody is more than welcome to join the group. We would also appreciate any comments from the more experienced players on the topic.

What you need
Luckily, the Hanon exercises are available online for free. You can download the exercises from the The Sheet Music Archive . Start with the first set of exercises as you can only download two of them per day.

How to practice?
Since I’m not an expert on this, I will try to describe what I am planning to do. To come up with schedule, I used a couple of books as well as my teacher's suggestions.

First Day: Choose an exercise. You don’t need to follow the exercises in the given order. One suggested ordering is as follows: 1-10-5-6-8-9-4-2-3-7. In the first day get familiar with the exercise and memorize it. Play the exercise 5 times. Do not overpractice
Days 2-? We will play the exercises with different rhythms, different dynamics and finally different touches so that they don't get boring. You can use the rhythms given in the following pdf file (ignore the first page, it’s there because I’m using the trial version of the notation software):
http://ieor.berkeley.edu/~ieor221/hanon-different-rhythms.pdf

To be precise, these rhythms are for the first exercise, but you can use the same rhythm structures for the others.

Starting in the second day, play as many of these rhythms once each. Try not to overpractice.

Remaining days Try different touches (Legato, hand staccato, portamento, finger staccoto) and different dynamics (loud-soft-loud-soft, loud-loud-soft-soft etc. or you can gradually go from loud to soft or vice versa). Don’t worry if the staccatos are not as fast as legato, it’s normal.
• After 7 days you’re done with the exercise. Don’t try to reach a speed of 108 as advised in the original text. Play at a comfortable speed.
Next Choose another exercise and start from the first day. Repeat the previously learnt exercises every day. The final goal is to be able to play all, say, 20 exercises back to back at one shot. Again, the speed is not as crucial as finding the most relaxed playing position. The speed will come naturally anyway.

What is this thread for

First, any ideas (different variations for instance), comments and practicing experiences are welcome. Second, please post a message when you’re starting an exercise and another one when you’re finished with it. For instance, if you finished the 5th and you already know the first 4, post a message telling us you know #1-2-3-4-5. This way, we will know who is studying what and this will also help motivate ourselves.

Every 4-5 weeks, I’m planning to open a new thread and summarize what’s going on with the group members individually using the messages you posted.

Current members
Debussy20 [1-20,]
Dannylux [1-20]
Ishmael [1-4]
fretfulhands [1-3]
Trainlady [1-2]
Yellowville [1,]
Funburger [1,]
crystalncrew [1,]


Boogie Woogie Hanon and Jazz Hanon group:
Pastafarian
FurElise
Agilita [1-3,]

Of course, if you like you can do 2 every week, or 1 biweekly.

One last word from "The Art of Practicing" by Madeline Bruser:


“A particularly dangerous form of struggling is practicing through physical pain. Some musicians feel it’s necessary to experience muscle soreness, as if they were pumping iron, when working hard to develop technique. This is a completely false notion. Pain is an indication that you are over-using a limited muscle group, using the wrong muscles, or using too much force. It is a signal to relax and slow down!


Any suggestions? Does it look good?

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Re: HANON study group #1124422
06/07/06 02:33 AM
06/07/06 02:33 AM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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I started with exercise #1 yesterday. I will follow them in the given order.

I played the first one 5 times yesterday and today I played it with the different rhythms given in the pdf in the first message. I also combined some of these rhythms with different dynamics. It took about 10-15 minutes. So far it's actually fun to play the exercise. I also tried portamento and hand staccato although hand staccato were very slow. I'm not going to focus on different touches for a while.

Re: HANON study group #1124423
06/07/06 05:43 AM
06/07/06 05:43 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,540
Pennsylvania
Ken Knapp Offline

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I have just added the PDF files for the Hanon exercises to the files section of the YAHOO group NEPApiano. You can join the group through the link in my signature line.

I could do a few cd's of the pdf's if there is someone who can't download due to a slow connection.

Ken


Ken

Hammond Organ Technician
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Re: HANON study group #1124424
06/07/06 11:11 AM
06/07/06 11:11 AM
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Posts: 246
Ithaca, NY
yellowville Offline
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I'll start with number one today. I've played it before, but never with different rhythms. One thing that I've done with other exercises is to do different touches with each hand: say staccato with the left and legato with the right. I find that quite challenging.

I'll let you know how it goes... I intend to do the exercises in order, too.


That man is richest whose pleasures are the cheapest. - H. D. Thoreau
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Re: HANON study group #1124425
06/07/06 12:48 PM
06/07/06 12:48 PM
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Posts: 57
Tarrytown, New York
FurElise Offline
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I'm not an "official" member of this group, but I'm going to be trying out the intermediate to early advanced group. On that thread I talked about Czerny and Burgmuller for alternatives to Hanon.

However, I was wondering do any of you own Boogie Woogie Hanon and Jazz Hanon? I have both. If you do have one or both, would you be interested in tackling those exercises? Aside from my classical ambitions (Chopin mainly), I really want to learn ragtime--Joplin. I don't so much care about learning to improvise--maybe I will along the road.

Anyway, please chime in if you're interested in these exercises. And, thanks. I didn't know that Hanon was available on the Web. I guess that I haven't discovered the world of freebie music downloads.

Re: HANON study group #1124426
06/07/06 01:15 PM
06/07/06 01:15 PM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 379
Canada
pastafarian Offline
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Quote
However, I was wondering do any of you own Boogie Woogie Hanon and Jazz Hanon? I have both. If you do have one or both, would you be interested in tackling those exercises? Aside from my classical ambitions (Chopin mainly), I really want to learn ragtime--Joplin. I don't so much care about learning to improvise--maybe I will along the road.
I'll do Boogie Woogie Hanon. I've already got a dozen or so of those under my fingers, they're simple at the beginning, but Part 2 is pretty scary looking.


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124427
06/07/06 01:23 PM
06/07/06 01:23 PM
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Cookie74 Offline
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Probably most know this, but for those who don't. . . the Hanon exercises are meant to be played in all the keys, not just C major. I wouldn't reccomend trying to do all keys for all the exercises, but as you switch exercises, you may consider switching the key as well.


" I wish you music to help with the burdens of life, and to help you release your happiness to others."

--Ludwig van Beethoven
Re: HANON study group #1124428
06/07/06 01:45 PM
06/07/06 01:45 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by cookie74:
Probably most know this, but for those who don't. . . the Hanon exercises are meant to be played in all the keys, not just C major. I wouldn't reccomend trying to do all keys for all the exercises, but as you switch exercises, you may consider switching the key as well.
Actually this is one of the things that worries me. But, I'll still do the first 10 in C major. Then, I will switch to another key depending on the piece I'll be working on.

Re: HANON study group #1124429
06/07/06 01:46 PM
06/07/06 01:46 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by yellowville:
I'll start with number one today. I've played it before, but never with different rhythms. One thing that I've done with other exercises is to do different touches with each hand: say staccato with the left and legato with the right. I find that quite challenging.

I'll let you know how it goes... I intend to do the exercises in order, too.
Different touches in each hand seems to be a good idea. I'll try that.

Re: HANON study group #1124430
06/07/06 02:20 PM
06/07/06 02:20 PM
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LiszThalberg Offline
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I did learned 1-12 today and am going to learn 13-20 tomorrow

Re: HANON study group #1124431
06/07/06 02:30 PM
06/07/06 02:30 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by Debussy20:
I did learned 1-12 today and am going to learn 13-20 tomorrow
Wow! You're fast. I'm going to stick with the first one for this week.

Re: HANON study group #1124432
06/07/06 02:51 PM
06/07/06 02:51 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by FurElise:
I'm not an "official" member of this group, but I'm going to be trying out the intermediate to early advanced group. On that thread I talked about Czerny and Burgmuller for alternatives to Hanon.

However, I was wondering do any of you own Boogie Woogie Hanon and Jazz Hanon? I have both. If you do have one or both, would you be interested in tackling those exercises? Aside from my classical ambitions (Chopin mainly), I really want to learn ragtime--Joplin. I don't so much care about learning to improvise--maybe I will along the road.

Anyway, please chime in if you're interested in these exercises. And, thanks. I didn't know that Hanon was available on the Web. I guess that I haven't discovered the world of freebie music downloads.
I'm adding you and pastafarian to the member list. Keep us posted.

BTW, how are these two related to (or different from)the Hanon we're currently practicing?

Re: HANON study group #1124433
06/07/06 03:09 PM
06/07/06 03:09 PM
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Posts: 379
Canada
pastafarian Offline
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Quote
BTW, how are these two related to (or different from)the Hanon we're currently practicing?
I don't about the Jazz hanon, but the Boogie Woogie Hanon is a series of (at least initially) simple, largely rather unmusical boogie-woogie type exercises, followed by a section of substantially more difficult boogie-woogie shorts pieces.

While they are somewhat dull, they do help with hand independence --which they demand very gradually-- I've played more than a dozen of them and not been challenged much in that regard, though at higher tempos (>120 bpm) they are trickier. They do a lot of what Tim Richards calls "five finger postion thirds" which are very useful for his book, so I assume for Blues piano in general. These can be challenging to play legato at high tempos.

They're all in C, so I've transposed a few. Also, I tend to play the RH parts with different LH parts.

They're certainly far more musically satisfying than classic Hanon exercises (if you like blues changes and don't get bored by them), and they do increase in difficulty very gradually. I suspect that the whole first section would give a good foundation for aspiring boogie-woogie players. The second half is a fair way out of my reach at the moment, though.


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124434
06/07/06 03:09 PM
06/07/06 03:09 PM
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Add me too! I decided to go ahead and work with the Hanon exercises instead of Czerny. I am going to go ahead with the suggested schedule of 1 a week. I really like these exercises because it forces you to relax and that is something I have difficulty with. My pinky fingers have ALWAYS stuck up mad when not in use. Doing this exercise allowed me to concentrate on relaxing and getting that pinky down!! thumb
Crystal

Re: HANON study group #1124435
06/07/06 03:12 PM
06/07/06 03:12 PM
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LiszThalberg Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Ishmael:
QUOTE]Wow! You're fast. I'm going to stick with the first one for this week. [/QB]
I orgininally learned them when i was 10 or 11, but i stoped playing and now because i started playing again, I must learn them again.

Re: HANON study group #1124436
06/07/06 03:23 PM
06/07/06 03:23 PM
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funburger Offline
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ok i will start with them today. our power was out and cable yesterday so i am gettin a late start. so i am in, will start working on them today--also what the heck is boogie woogie hanon???


If it ain't fun I ain't doin' it:)
Re: HANON study group #1124437
06/07/06 03:28 PM
06/07/06 03:28 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by crystalncrew:
Add me too! I decided to go ahead and work with the Hanon exercises instead of Czerny. I am going to go ahead with the suggested schedule of 1 a week. I really like these exercises because it forces you to relax and that is something I have difficulty with. My pinky fingers have ALWAYS stuck up mad when not in use. Doing this exercise allowed me to concentrate on relaxing and getting that pinky down!! thumb
Crystal
Thanks for pointing that out again. Yes, it is crucial that we play these exercises relaxed without getting tired or sore muscles. Most of the time, I think, we can't relax because we are playing it too fast.

Also, if you experience a sore muscle while you're playing slow down but DON'T stop; try to figure out a way to REST that muscle while you're continuing playing. This helps finding the relaxed hand position.

Re: HANON study group #1124438
06/07/06 03:29 PM
06/07/06 03:29 PM
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pastafarian Offline
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Funburger, read my post above. wink

I'll pick a regular hanon and a Boogie-Woogie Hanon fora a week. My regular Hanon will be #15 and I'll choose the BWH tonight.


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124439
06/07/06 03:47 PM
06/07/06 03:47 PM
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Agilita Offline
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I've already signed up for several other groups and am probably over-extending myself but I was given "Boogie Woogie Hanon" as a gift and haven't opened the cover yet, so I'd like to try to join in. I'll look at the book tonight.

Funburger: Boogie Woogie Hanon is kind of a technical exercise book. Hanon with a walking bass, maybe?

Re: HANON study group #1124440
06/07/06 04:05 PM
06/07/06 04:05 PM
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Ithaca, NY
yellowville Offline
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I'm only going to do Hanon in C. Transposing all sixty (or just the first 40 or so, since the rest are scales) would be tedious **beyond words**!


That man is richest whose pleasures are the cheapest. - H. D. Thoreau
Re: HANON study group #1124441
06/07/06 04:20 PM
06/07/06 04:20 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Originally posted by yellowville:
I'm only going to do Hanon in C. Transposing all sixty (or just the first 40 or so, since the rest are scales) would be tedious **beyond words**!
I don't think you need to do it in all keys. But, say, you're learning a music piece which is in G major. Then, it would be beneficial to do it in G major once in a while. For the time being though, I'm going to do it only in C major as well. If nothing, it will help my fingers gain some strength.

Re: HANON study group #1124442
06/07/06 04:24 PM
06/07/06 04:24 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by Agilita:
I've already signed up for several other groups and am probably over-extending myself but I was given "Boogie Woogie Hanon" as a gift and haven't opened the cover yet, so I'd like to try to join in. I'll look at the book tonight.

Funburger: Boogie Woogie Hanon is kind of a technical exercise book. Hanon with a walking bass, maybe?
Welcome, I added you to the list. Let us know how it went.

Re: HANON study group #1124443
06/07/06 05:48 PM
06/07/06 05:48 PM
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Canada
pastafarian Offline
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Ishmael, how do you see this working?

The classic Hanons are pretty much identical, with subtle fingering changes, while the BW Hanons are like little pieces and aside from the I IV, V progression, they can be completely different from one another. For example, I'm going to work on #s 8 and 9. The challenge in 8 is co-ordinating rising 3rds and 2nds in one hand with descending movement in the other, while the real challenge in 9 is get the five-finger thirds in the RH to be legato as well as fast.
So, do we report speeds at the end of the week or shall we post recordings?


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124444
06/07/06 06:05 PM
06/07/06 06:05 PM
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Ishmael Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by pastafarian:
Ishmael, how do you see this working?

The classic Hanons are pretty much identical, with subtle fingering changes, while the BW Hanons are like little pieces and aside from the I IV, V progression, they can be completely different from one another. For example, I'm going to work on #s 8 and 9. The challenge in 8 is co-ordinating rising 3rds and 2nds in one hand with descending movement in the other, while the real challenge in 9 is get the five-finger thirds in the RH to be legato as well as fast.
So, do we report speeds at the end of the week or shall we post recordings?
I don't think you need to send the recordings unless you want some feedback from other people who are also working on it. Just post which exercises you have mastered (or simply passed) as you finish them, this way we will see who's doing what and that will keep us motivated. If you also want to post the speed, you can do so. But we're not trying to reach the speed given in the book anyway (108).

You can also post how you're practicing them once in a while if you're doing something different. For instance, here's a message from yellowville:

"I'll start with number one today. I've played it before, but never with different rhythms. One thing that I've done with other exercises is to do different touches with each hand: say staccato with the left and legato with the right. I find that quite challenging."

I haven't thought of doing different touches until his/her message although it's quite important b/c in many passages left hand plays staccato while the left hand plays legato.

A similar thing to do might be playing louder on the right hand. B/c again most of the time the melody should be louder than the left hand.

I'll start writing which exercises are mastered by whom in a week or so. (Like Ishmael (1-2-3), yellowville (4-5)). And also, after about a month let's open another thread and see how everybody is doing. Let's also put a tentative, informal goal: Master 4 exercises in a month.

Re: HANON study group #1124445
06/07/06 06:37 PM
06/07/06 06:37 PM
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pastafarian Offline
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OK, I'm with it.

The Boogie-Woogie Hanons are postable though, as they are little pieces and cry out for innovation and mix-and-match right and left hand parts. I agree that the classic Hanons wouldn't make very interesting listening at all...


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124446
06/08/06 11:21 AM
06/08/06 11:21 AM
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Missouri
Agilita Offline
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I worked on the first 3 exercises in BW Hanon last night. Although I can still read the notes, not having played since childhood music lessons means that I don't remember any theory, symbols, etc. I assume that the marking in measures 2, 3, etc., of exercise 1 (and others) means that you repeat the previous measure?

Re: HANON study group #1124447
06/08/06 11:51 AM
06/08/06 11:51 AM
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pastafarian Offline
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I assume that the marking in measures 2, 3, etc., of exercise 1 (and others) means that you repeat the previous measure?
Yup. How are you finding them?


Without music life would be a mistake
-- Friedrich Nietzsche
Re: HANON study group #1124448
06/08/06 11:56 AM
06/08/06 11:56 AM
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Cookie74 Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by yellowville:
I'm only going to do Hanon in C. Transposing all sixty (or just the first 40 or so, since the rest are scales) would be tedious **beyond words**!
I think there are only 12 major keys.


" I wish you music to help with the burdens of life, and to help you release your happiness to others."

--Ludwig van Beethoven
Re: HANON study group #1124449
06/08/06 12:00 PM
06/08/06 12:00 PM
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Missouri
Agilita Offline
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Pastafarian: I've been working on playing the Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy which is quite challenging. So, these exercises seemed fairly simple. Further on in the book looks harder.

ccokie74: I think that yellowville was referring to the 60 Hanon exercises. My book only has the first 20 but I know that the complete book has 60.

Re: HANON study group #1124450
06/08/06 12:14 PM
06/08/06 12:14 PM
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Posts: 246
Ithaca, NY
yellowville Offline
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Sheesh! SIXTY keys! I'd quit piano if that were the case!

Yes, I'm talking about all the exercises. The book states that all the exercises, once learned, should ideally be done every day. I would like to play the whole book maybe once a week or so, but probably not every day.


That man is richest whose pleasures are the cheapest. - H. D. Thoreau
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Free Jazz Lesson Hangout this Wed. 7/25 w/Dave Frank
by Dfrankjazz. 07/23/18 10:14 AM
OT - but cute, I hope
by Rich Galassini. 07/23/18 09:59 AM
An irresistable bar [measure]
by Fareham. 07/23/18 09:17 AM
Digital pianos with good “organ touch”
by MarioPf. 07/23/18 08:38 AM
anyone have experience with...
by grand_piano_dreame. 07/22/18 06:03 PM
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Pianoteq
PianoTeq Steingraeber
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Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
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