Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum New Study Group for Chopin's Nocturne in C# m (Posth)

Hey...great to have you, bkmd and Bassio:

bkmd: Maybe Ragnhild can help you with the mazurka part. I haven't gotten there yet. But don't you just love it? The way he sticks it in there amid all that sorrow.

Bassio: I am a big one for being fussy about which score to use. Part of that stems from my cheapness in spending more money when I already have the score on a CD. It might not be exactly correct, but then I am not going to play it on the concert stage for all kinds of music critics to hear. So if I am missing a note, here or there, I don't consider it a big deal.

Now I know there are some purist out there, and that's great. I certainly admire this quality. So Bassio, chose the score you like the best. I personally think they will all be pretty much the same (at least, I hope.)

Let's try to post on a somewhat regular basis if we can. Then maybe some brave soul can record when he/she feels ready. I know because of those runs, I won't be for at least another month. Otherwise the piece is relatively easy.

Good luck to all.

Kathleen

I suggest we start with the score-correcting process first. There are too many editions floating there.

My printer is ready .. and I will try to look for my older score (which I hope was not lost in the process of moving) which contained corrections as advised by my teacher's ancient score edition .. which made more sense than the public domain editions floating on the net.

BTW I recollect that the edition on sheetmusicarchive SUCKED bigtime.

Kathleen, I am the furthest one from a purist. But thanks for the compliment

But the editions of this piece found on the net contain too many modifications (and even mistakes .. harmonically speaking) by editors who think they are improving upon the master.

That is why we can hear here different notes between performers such as Arrau and Ashkenazy.

At the end, of course, anyone can play the piece with the notes he like But putting this issue in mind may help a lot. And I think this is a general issue with all posthumous works of Chopin .. if he was alive back then he would have known how to deal with such "forgeries" Remember how he went nuts when Liszt added some embellishments when he performed his pieces.

I would love to join the club. This is a beautiful piece . IT would be totally from scratch for me! As long as I wouldn't have to play it in public for say...10 years? :rolleyes:


*** Signing off to look for the score***

Hi Crazy Mom:

Dee: Welcome and no, you would never have to play, ever...if you don't want to.

Stay in touch and feel free to ask questions whenever. We will be taking it slowly so not to worry. There is never a rush with these study groups,

Regards,
Kathleen

Hi Again Bassio:

I certainly agree that we should get the edition that is the closest as possible to the real thing, but how do we know. I guess the Urtext versions are considered the best. Or perhaps we can download the version from that free site. It is a Chopin site, so I would hope it would be accurate. What do you think?

Kathleen

Holy Schmoly! You're right Bassio, I found the score on sheetmusicarchive, and it doesn't have any fingering on it. I'll have to look somewhere else.

At first glance, it looks manageable. I will just pretend that measures 58,59,60 and 61 don't exist.

That's the idea. Like:

"I'll cross that bridge when I come to it."

Kathleen

I like "I'll burn that bridge when I come to it!"

URTEXT. Definitely. My Preludes are URTEXT. Love it. The book itself is of a higher quality - has string in it, and stays open to your page without need for a paper clip.

Or one of those expensive Polish editions if you can find it.

So are you planning to cross it at all? or are you going to build a simpler bridge?

I thought you burned bridges AFTER you crossed them. :p

Kathleen

unless you can jump very far!

Can I join even if I'm not an adult? I've always wanted to play this piece and It probably wouldn't take me too long.

xtraheat... i'm not an adult either. but don't tell anyone! Sssshhhhhh!

I like the humour of this gruop - and I like burning bridges before and after...

Just to clear up the misunderstanding - I don't play this piece, I just like it
What I don't like is that I don't have time to practice it.

I don't know much theory either, but I find it interesting, and it is always possible to ask Pianojerome.

I will lurk often in this thread, though....

Ragnhild

Of course, Sam, you can join, and we're happy to have you. And naturally, Debussy20, you're in.

Ragnhild: You play so beautifully (I still have to listen to the recital; I'm waiting until I am alone in the house.) Please lurk as I believe we just might have some questions that perhaps you could help with. Even though you don't play it, it's a piece that is a fairly easy read. So, thank you.

And as far as bridges...when you get to be 68, you can't jump very far. In fact, you can't jump at all. So burning seems to work nicely. :p

Kathleen

I think this was one of the first pieces of classical music I ever heard. Love the opening, so elegant.....My favourite part, though, is the middle, when there is a small, brief, major key interlude, but it's gone as soon as it came. It's a really interesting effect...

Hey, I figured out the reason for the double sharp in measure two.

That chord is a German 6/5 chord. The interval between the A and the Fdoub.# is an augmented sixth.

So it would be a German 6/5 chord, the root of the chord though is actully the Fdoub. sharp.

The reason it is a german 6/5 instead of a VI7 chord, is for the way the chord resolves and the way Chopin chose to use the Fdoub.#

A VI7 chord would have been written with a G nat.


---Hope this isn't confusing and I hope someone gets smoething out of it for those who were wanting to know a little theory behind the piece.

If you say so, Vanityx3. I'll take your word for it.

Kathleen

Vanityx3, good that you clear things out - it is a German sixth: (minor)6 - 1 - (minor)3 -#4. It is resolved to V with the paralell fifth (two lower voices),that is normally not accepted in composition.

I think it works just fine, when Chopin uses it .....

I hope I'm excused since the VI7 chord has the same notes. How would one proceed from a a VI7 ?

Ragnhild