Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Negative stereotypes associated with classical music/players.

Bit wrangler, you are unequivocally incorrect. In fact by and large "classical composers" composed directly for the aristocracy.They were essentially "court musicians". This is true of Bach, Haydn, Mozart to name a few. These were not public performances. Only by the 20th century did this system of patronage disappear...as did by and large a large output of "classical music". There was always music for the masses. Bawdy popular songs and the like.

Oops, I believe that Bach was in the permanent employ of the Lutheran church by and large.

John Pels Writes: "It will always appeal to the rich and cultured"

I'm rich, I'm at the top 1 percentile of income, and yes I consider myself cultured! I HATE CLASSICAL MUSIC, IT HURTS MY EARS!

Originally posted by SEODave:
At a recent Paul McCartney concert, he told us the story of the origin of "Blackbird": many years ago (during either the early Beatles or pre-Beatles years, I don't remember), he and George Harrison were listening to a piece by Bach- don't remember which- and they were both trying to play it on their guitars. They didn't quite succeed, but from Paul's end what emerged was the basis for the song "Blackbird"!
I thought this was such a cool story and painted an amazing picture- these two young rockers, listening to Bach and trying to play his music! And we though that Elvis and Little Richard, etc. were their main influences
I also read somewhere that the Beatles' song "Because" (Abbey Road) was inspired by one of them- or perhaps Yoko- playing "something by Beethoven" pn the piano. I guessed it was the familiar movement of "Moonlight Sonata".
So, it seems that classical music is everywhere, whether you realize it or not!

Chardonnay: Interesting story...and welcome to the forum! I was curious to know what the particular Bach piece was and a little googling finds:

McCartney revealed on PBS's Great Performances (Paul McCartney: Chaos and Creation at Abbey Road), aired in 2006, that the guitar accompaniment for Blackbird was inspired by the Bourée from Bach's e-minor Lute Suite (BWV 996). As kids, he and George Harrison tried to learn this Bourée as a "show off" piece. The piece is distinguished by melody and bass notes played simultaneously on the upper and lower strings. McCartney adapted a segment of the Bourée as the opening of "Blackbird," and carried the musical idea throughout the song.
That particular piece of music was also used more directly and more famously perhaps by Jethro Tull.

Hi jazzyprof, thanks for the welcome- and thanks for digging a little deeper into that story! I felt bad that I didn't remember the particular Bach piece, and now this fills in the gaps!

I love "Blackbird"- my favorite McCartney acoustic piece. I also really enjoy hearing the "story behind the song", as it's often quite unusual (and at times, inspired by classical pieces).

There's been no better time in history for EVERYONE to have access to classical music - either to listen, or to learn to perform.

Every time I go to a store that sells CDs, I see racks stuffed full of classical music compilations, often at ridiculously low prices (starting at $3-$6 per CD). These recordings usually are not performed by famous classical musicians, but are still more-than-competently performed.

You can buy several of these "cheap" classical CDs for the cost of ONE album from the lame pop band du jour.

Just a few years ago we didn't have the Sheet Music Archive (or other similar sites) providing free piano scores for many classical works.

And last but not least, prices for digital pianos with weighted keys are lower (in real terms) than they've ever been. Ten years ago, it would have been unthinkable that you could get an 88-key hammer-action keyboard for about $500.

The music is more accessible than ever, but most people I know who are into classical music are either hard-core music lovers, or they have artistic/intellectual interests in general.

I'd also add that music has become "commoditized" and many people just don't appreciate how much work it takes to become an accomplished musician. When you see those racks in stores stuffed with professional-caliber performances, on sale for $3 a shot, it's easy to be deceived into thinking it took no effort to produce the CD.

Just a small comment:

As far as those interested in the classics being thought of in a negative way....I ALWAYS consider the source. Short and simple! Give it a try.

Kathleen

Famous composers and their years of existence:

J.S. Bach: 21 March 1685. – 28 July 1750
Mozart: January 27, 1756 – December 5, 1791
Beethoven: December 17, 1770 – March 26, 1827
Chopin: March 1, 1810 – October 17, 1849

Now seriously, what bands/artists that are currently famous are going to be talked about and performed 300 years from now? I honestly can't think of any. Maybe there will be, but the fact that these classical composers are still making an impact on music hundreds of years after their death says a lot. To say that classical music is going away soon, is one of most ridiculous and silly things I've heard in a long time. If classical music has survived for more than a dozen generations, why would it all of the sudden just die? I'm only speaking for myself here, but I much rather go to a piano concerto then get my eardrums destroyed at a rock concert. Do I sound like an old geezer? I'm 25.

This is an interesting conversation. Haven't read it all and I'm chiming in late here. My two bits....

We are comparing two different things here i think. Yes it is all musical in some way or another, but by and large, classical music is a language of pure music and nothing else. But modern music is music and verse. The message of modern music is much more in your face rather than appealing to pure emotion. So, when we talk about the last century's and especially the last 10 or 20 years of music, we are talking more about people's thoughts expressed in words and set to simple music with extremely powerful rhythms. Today's popular musics are all very different than classical. I like so many styles of music, but I would venture to say that as an art form, music is degenerating proportionally to the decline of the soul. Music offers very little these days compared to past centuries. When I listen to music, I don't usually hear or care about the lyrics. Music is music. It speaks to the soul. Verse is verse, not music. Many "artists" today just use their underdeveloped musical talent to create catchy noise as a platform to complain. Sure, its art.... but it sure ain't what it used to be.

"There you go again about the low mentality of River City people and taking it all too much to heart."

That's what Marian's mother told her in The Music Man.

Perhaps you are taking it all too much to heart.

If someone rolls his eyes and yawns when you mention classical music, then change the subject, and find someone else to discuss classical.

Why let it bug you?

because we like to progress, not regress?

I guess I just don't "get" it. I do not see how obsessing about it will lead to progress. There is no such thing as changing people's taste in music as a result of talking to them. Sure, they might pretend to have seen the light just to change the subject, but then they will go right back to ignoring classical.

Great music and great literature have always been the province of a select minority who somehow spied out its value and developed a taste for it.

I see no reason to think that will change, or ever could change. I also see nothing in that fact that should cause any substantive concern. It is in the nature of things, and it is just fine that way.

After all, we are just talking about an emotional reaction to a fact. You could feel bad about your taste being rare, or you could take pride in it, or you could be amused by it, or you could ignore it, or whatever else. It's a free country.

Prospero asked: "Why let it bug you?"

Than later, he said: "There is no such thing as changing people's taste in music as a result of talking to them."

I guess my concern about classical music is that it is an "acquired taste". You have to go out of your way to be exposed to it, and then the pursuit of classical music can lead into so many directions, orchestral, opera, solo instruments, and the huge classical literature. One can appreciate it without having to play it, as an audience ment, or one can dig in and pursue the musicians role and play it.

Communicating about classical music could help develop a person's understanding of it, if he would listen and give it a chance. The quick rush to judgment without testing it out personally (maybe you would find things to like about it) deprives you of something many of us think of as a significant thing - something that touches our minds and spirits as nothing else can.

The music history appreciation is a significant thing too. This is about 300 years of history on the keyboard instruments, and much older to antiquity for drum and flute-like instruments. Men's voices, then later, women's. There is also "music" on-going in the universe - music of the sphere's.

Opening your mind to classical brings a whole different world to you then the one you are living in this contemporary society. That probably, to me, is my most important point. If gives me a world of beauty and refuge to hold on to.

Intellectual (inner world) is very different from music as socialization.

Each of us finds our significant pleasure musically.

I have spend decades around people (Professors) who all claim that they have been "emotionally and intellectually touched in a way that nothing else can move a person" from, hmmm..., let's see:

climbing atop Mt. McKinley,

reading the New Testament in the original Koine Greek,

spending a year in a mountaintop monastery in Tibet,

learning how to surf "in the tube" in the big waves in Hawaii,

reading Rousseau in the original French,

learning to play the violin,

going to Confession every week for a year,

becoming deeply engrossed in the development of higher mathematics,

learning how to handle a handgun properly,

donating a truly hefty chunk of your income to a worthy charity,

volunteering to mentor a fatherless child,

reading the pure and magnificent language of Plato and Homer in the original ancient Greek,

training kindergarten teachers,

carefully excavating ancient Aztec artifacts in remote Mexican locales,

writing a weekly column for a major newspaper,

perusing the papers of Thomas Jefferson,

deliberately trying to imitate the works of the great English poets,

taking up botany,

studying the amazing career of George Washington,

taking more time to pay attention to their children every single day,

watching Sister Angelica's shows,

reading Darwin with maximum attentiveness,

participating in a mock debate of the original Constitutional Convention,

volunteering to serve needy African peoples,

buying a boat,

learning how to appreciate and critique great paintings,

cultivating a magnificent backyard garden,

writing a new, different, original, passionate love-letter to your spouse once a week every week,

studying the rough drafts of great books and comparing them to the final copy,

lying on the beach in Honolulu writing sonnets,

hunting deer,

running a marathon,

learning how to appreciate and critique great sculpture,

setting aside a day each month to surprise each of your children by doing something he or she would love but never guessed you would ever do,

flying a single-engine aircraft,

becoming fluent in two new languages,

visiting Mecca,

going on a pilgrimmage to Lourdes,

taking up scuba-diving,

delving into therapy even if you don't need it,

spending a summer in a Seminary,

and, oh, yes,

developing a taste for classical music.


The list could be longer--I just grew weary--but the point is that I have never heard any reason why we should be trying to talk people into doing the last thing on that list. Many things can be deeply moving and extraordinarily worthwhile. Many of those are not all that difficult to do, either, and just need to be tried. Classical music is just one of many great things in this world, and not everyone need love it.

Sure, lots of people would love classical music if they gave it a fair try--but they would love lots of other things, too. Our taste need not be their taste. Love a world with variety. Celebrate it.

Prospero, I love your list!

Yes, so many things to do, so little time.

Celebrate variety!

Open as many doors as possible in life!

(ADD: "Get out of my rut!")

Betty

Third the motion. My dad taught me to live life this way and I have. I am a happy older woman as a result. Most of all treat people with respect he told me and have fun beyond this point. Cheers, Sandy B

Considerably more than 300 years of keyboard music, Betty.

Mary-Rose,

Please give me some dates, I was thinking off the top of my head and 300 would be 1707. To be correct, we should referance clavichords, harpsichords.

Antiquity here we come!

Betty

Well, virginals date from the 15th century.