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Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050609
11/16/08 07:20 AM
11/16/08 07:20 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 43
Charlottesville, Virginia
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Patrick Toomey Offline OP
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Charlottesville, Virginia
Can someone out there share with their secrets about how to insert the symbols for sharp, flat and natural into a word processing document. I work on an iMac MAC-OS platform and use MS Word. Recently I attempted to create a table for my own use showing the various keys, the degrees of the scale and a column of which sharps or flats were used/needed and the individual notes that were needed in a particular chord. I was shocked to discover that none of the symbol tables included in Word or anywhere else that I looked had a sharp, flat or natural symbol! How do y'all do that. I had no idea that these were not ASCII characters.

Patrick
Charlottesville, VA

PS: 21st century, men on the moon, iTunes, Netflix, our first Black president, and no way to write music symbols. Have we really evolved very far as a culture?


Patrick Toomey
Charlottesville, Virginia USA
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050610
11/16/08 07:37 AM
11/16/08 07:37 AM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,286
Lodz, Poland
Mati Offline
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Those are unicode symbols with codes U+266D, U+266E and U+266F respectively. If Mac Os has a program called "character map" or something similar they should be there to be found. But beware, not every font will support thet characters.

http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/266d/index.htm
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/266e/index.htm
http://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/266f/index.htm

You can also always copy them from here: ♭♮♯and make a document from which you will copy these symbols to your texts.

It's quite possible there is a simplier way - but I'm not a Mac user unfortunately. I hope someone else will give a greater insight on using unicode symbols in MacOS.


My best!
M.


Mateusz Papiernik
My youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/Maticomp
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050611
11/16/08 01:24 PM
11/16/08 01:24 PM
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Gyro Offline
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The symbols on a regular keyboard are
sufficient for accidentals. Sharp
is #, flat is lower-case b, natural is the
letter name of the note with nothing
next to it, double sharp or double flat
is ##, bb. So A natural, sharp, flat,
double sharp, double flat are, respectively:
A, A#, Ab, A##, Abb.

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050612
11/16/08 02:02 PM
11/16/08 02:02 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,286
Lodz, Poland
Mati Offline
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Gyro, they are as natural as Ł is for pound and S is for dollar. They are just substitutes for when you have no access to ♭♮♯. They DO differ in looks. They are convenient in fast discussion, but not in typesetting.


M.


Mateusz Papiernik
My youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/Maticomp
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050613
11/16/08 02:12 PM
11/16/08 02:12 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,922
Canada
keystring Offline
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Quote
You can also always copy them from here: ♭ ♮ ♯
Worth highlighting. Just did (copy). Thanks. smile

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050614
11/16/08 02:34 PM
11/16/08 02:34 PM
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South Florida
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Gary D. Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Mati:
Gyro, they are as natural as Ł is for pound and S is for dollar. They are just substitutes for when you have no access to ♭♮♯. They DO differ in looks. They are convenient in fast discussion, but not in typesetting.
I don't think any symbol exists for double sharp. I use "x" in a pinch, but it is rather confusing…


Piano Teacher
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050615
11/16/08 02:50 PM
11/16/08 02:50 PM
Joined: Nov 2005
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Lodz, Poland
Mati Offline
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There is 𝄪 for double sharp and 𝄫 for double flat - but not many fonts support them. As we can all see, default system fonts don't.


M.


Mateusz Papiernik
My youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/Maticomp
"One man can make a difference" - Wilton Knight
Kawai CN21 (digital), Henryk Yamayuri Kawai NX-40 (grand)
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050616
11/16/08 03:00 PM
11/16/08 03:00 PM
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Canada
keystring Offline
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Mati, I see two squares.

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050617
11/16/08 03:04 PM
11/16/08 03:04 PM
Joined: Aug 2006
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Briarcliff Manor, NY, USA
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sotto voce Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Gyro:
The symbols on a regular keyboard are
sufficient for accidentals. Sharp
is #, flat is lower-case b, natural is the
letter name of the note with nothing
next to it, double sharp or double flat
is ##, bb. So A natural, sharp, flat,
double sharp, double flat are, respectively:
A, A#, Ab, A##, Abb.
Wow, who would ever have been able to figure that out on their own?

Steven

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050618
11/16/08 03:06 PM
11/16/08 03:06 PM
Joined: Sep 2006
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rocket88 Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by Gyro:
natural is the letter name of the note with nothing
next to it.
If that's the case, how would you make an A natural that follows an A that has an accidental such as # before it in the same measure?

Simply putting an A as the second A would indicate that it also is sharped by the previous accidental. It would need a natural sign, or be referred to as a B double flat or G double sharp, both of which are clumsy, and likely not in the original score if one exists.


Piano teacher and Blues and Boogie-Woogie pianist.
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050619
11/16/08 03:15 PM
11/16/08 03:15 PM
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 6,236
South Florida
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Gary D. Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by keystring:
Mati, I see two squares.
He just told you that you wouldn't see them. The font here doesn't support the symbols. wink


Piano Teacher
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050620
11/16/08 03:19 PM
11/16/08 03:19 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,922
Canada
keystring Offline
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Quote
He just told you that you wouldn't see them. The font here doesn't support the symbols. wink
I'm slow on the uptake. "As you can see here" should have told me. Thanks.

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050621
11/18/08 12:03 AM
11/18/08 12:03 AM
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 43
Charlottesville, Virginia
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Patrick Toomey Offline OP
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Charlottesville, Virginia
Howdy all,
Turns out there is a way to insert almost all of the various musical codes IF a person is using a Mac! I was able to successfully use all of the various symbols that I needed simply by clicking a mouse from what ever application I was running at the time. Here are some fo the symbols available:

𝄞 𝄢 𝄪 𝄐 𝄫 ♭ ♬ ♫ ♪ ♩ ♭ ♮ ♯

The fellow that told me how to do this is from Australia and he got back to me on an iMac forum. Here is his explanation.


Character Palette is your friend.
Go to System Preferences.
In the International preference pane, select the 'Input Menu' tab.
Ensure that 'Character Palette' is ticked and 'Show input menu in menu bar' is ticked.
Close System Preferences.
In the menu bar at the upper right of your screen you will see a symbol of a flag r, and this indicates default keyboard layout that, when clicked with the mouse, is a drop-down box.
Select 'Show Character Palette'.
View: Code Tables and the Unicode tab.
Find your musical symbols under Miscellaneous Symbols AND Musical Symbols (no idea why they are split).
Select each symbol you wish to use and, using the drop-down box (lower left), Add each symbol in turn to favorites.
Now, whenever you want to add a musical symbol to a Word document just launch the Character Palette and select Favorites to get to the desired symbol.
Alternatively, make a new Word document, or a Sticky Note, and put your musical symbols in there. When you need a symbol just open the document or note, double-click on the symbol and drag it into your Word document.


Patrick Toomey
Charlottesville, Virginia USA
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? #1050622
11/21/08 04:32 AM
11/21/08 04:32 AM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 148
Cleveland, Ohio, US
Bryan P. Carney Offline
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Cleveland, Ohio, US
Because it wasn't mentioned, these special characters can by entered into any OS and its programs by the so-called Alt-codes.

On Windows boxes, these are entered by turning the number lock on and, with a numerical keypad - the square on the right of the KB, holding down the "Alt" key and entering a series of numbers. This number is simply the ASCII or Unicode designation for the symbol.

I have used Macs, PCs, Sun boxes, and all flavors of Unix and most systems accept the codes, assuming no hotkeys or additional functionality has supplanted the Alt-(x) character set function. Macs, additionally have stranger modifier keys which follow many schemes and none at all.

The most complete collection of Alt-codes I use is Alt Code Chart

Google "alt-codes" and "insert your Mac flavor" for the Mac's codes.

If you find yourself using particular special characters frequently, you can always reassign keys on your KB to them. Ask me for further details if needed.

HTH


=====================
nil volentibus arduum
Do it for Fux' sake.
=====================
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Bryan P. Carney] #1258306
08/29/09 12:26 AM
08/29/09 12:26 AM
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 8,453
Horowitzian Offline
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[deleted] Sorry for accidentally reviving an old topic!

Last edited by Horowitzian; 08/29/09 12:31 AM.

Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Horowitzian] #1258307
08/29/09 12:31 AM
08/29/09 12:31 AM
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Jersey Shore
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Mark... Offline
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You realize your response is 8 months late?

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Mark...] #1258308
08/29/09 12:31 AM
08/29/09 12:31 AM
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Horowitzian Offline
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Yeah, my forum view reverted to ascending sort. mad

Last edited by Horowitzian; 08/29/09 12:32 AM.

Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Horowitzian] #1353422
01/19/10 02:08 PM
01/19/10 02:08 PM
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I realize that this response is quite a bit after the initial request for assistance for sharp and flat fonts. However, it is still timely for those who are currently in search of information and reading older threads.

One of the problems that I have encountered with special musical fonts and fonts using Alt codes is that they do not match the text in size and style that you a person may wish to use. In particular, the vertical spacing required by some special fonts may interfere with the fonts and images above and below the special font.

One approach that I have found to work well is to search the fonts that are already installed on your computer to see which ones give you the most satisfactory image for the musical symbols you are looking for, in particular, sharp and flat fonts.

The technique that I use is to type a small b in a Word document, increase the size of the font to about 30 to make its features clearly visible, highlight it and begin with the fonts at the top of your font list to observe what that b looks like in your font set. Once your letter is highlighted, simply select fonts to get the dropdown active and use your Down arrow to scroll down through your fonts and watch as the b changes with each font. I have found that quite a few fonts make a passable flat symbol out of a b.

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Patrick Toomey] #2743470
06/10/18 04:10 PM
06/10/18 04:10 PM
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Again, forgive the delay in responding. I just found this site when searching for something else. I'm trusting someone will be able to find and use this in the future. Notation in Word documents can be achieved through various fonts installed on your system. To get the accidental markings, I have two different font families that I use. The first is Maestro and the second is Opus. You can begin looking on your system to see if you have any music notation fonts. The other option is trying to find a TTF font online. I'm not certain where I picked mine up. It may have come in with my Sibelius software. That's the way music manuscript software works. It uses fonts that when placed through the software are able to produce the music manuscript. I hope this helps someone.

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Patrick Toomey] #2743497
06/10/18 06:13 PM
06/10/18 06:13 PM
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Warsaw, Poland
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Why are you replying to a ten year old thread?


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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Patrick Toomey] #2743507
06/10/18 07:04 PM
06/10/18 07:04 PM
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Orange County, California
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He wanted to apologize for the delay in responding, lol

Quote
Again, forgive the delay in responding.


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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: bSharp(C)yclist] #2743516
06/10/18 07:42 PM
06/10/18 07:42 PM
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Florida
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Originally Posted by bSharp(C)yclist
He wanted to apologize for the delay in responding, lol

Quote
Again, forgive the delay in responding.


Oh for Pete’s Sake! He stated he was surfing the Internet looking for something else, and was trying to be helpful. He went to the trouble of opening an account and made a first post on PW, Are we giving a new poster our warmest welcome.????


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: dogperson] #2743526
06/10/18 08:46 PM
06/10/18 08:46 PM
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NobleHouse Offline
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Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by bSharp(C)yclist
He wanted to apologize for the delay in responding, lol

Quote
Again, forgive the delay in responding.


Oh for Pete’s Sake! He stated he was surfing the Internet looking for something else, and was trying to be helpful. He went to the trouble of opening an account and made a first post on PW, Are we giving a new poster our warmest welcome.????


Agree with dogperson! I actually learned something new because of nojunk responding to this post!

Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: Patrick Toomey] #2743527
06/10/18 08:52 PM
06/10/18 08:52 PM
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Florida
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Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: NobleHouse] #2743535
06/10/18 09:48 PM
06/10/18 09:48 PM
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Wisconsin, USA
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Originally Posted by NobleHouse
Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by bSharp(C)yclist
He wanted to apologize for the delay in responding, lol

Quote
Again, forgive the delay in responding.


Oh for Pete’s Sake! He stated he was surfing the Internet looking for something else, and was trying to be helpful. He went to the trouble of opening an account and made a first post on PW, Are we giving a new poster our warmest welcome.????


Agree with dogperson! I actually learned something new because of nojunk responding to this post!


Totally agree here as well. Dogperson is great and so are dogs!


Bösendorfer 170
Re: Symbols for sharp , flat and natural on a computer? [Re: nojunk] #2743538
06/10/18 09:56 PM
06/10/18 09:56 PM
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 15,922
Canada
keystring Offline
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Nojunk - Thank you for providing us with this information and welcome to PW. smile Useful information is always "timely". smile
Originally Posted by nojunk
Again, forgive the delay in responding. I just found this site when searching for something else. I'm trusting someone will be able to find and use this in the future. Notation in Word documents can be achieved through various fonts installed on your system. To get the accidental markings, I have two different font families that I use. The first is Maestro and the second is Opus. You can begin looking on your system to see if you have any music notation fonts. The other option is trying to find a TTF font online. I'm not certain where I picked mine up. It may have come in with my Sibelius software. That's the way music manuscript software works. It uses fonts that when placed through the software are able to produce the music manuscript. I hope this helps someone.


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