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#1000313 - 07/17/08 10:08 PM Relaxing (away from the piano)
saerra Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/28/07
Posts: 842
Loc: Atlanta, GA
I am not a relaxed person. Especially right now, apparently, I'm really very much the opposite of relaxed ;\) (It's bad when you wake up, are not sure what day it is, then PANIC because you can't remember what day it is and if you need to be getting ready for work, right? ;\) )

I know I need to work on relaxing AT the piano, BUT I think (and my teacher, not surprising, completely agrees) that I need to be finding ways to "relax" away from the piano too.

What works for you?

If you are also not naturally an easy-going, relaxed person, has anything helped?

I've been thinking about getting some meditation/relaxation CDs - any suggestions of good ones? I may try some yoga too, recommended by a friend, but really - it's the same problem as I posted about in "fitting it all in" - how do I fit in MORE stuff, especially more stuff that feels like a "chore" and less like "fun" (when it already feels like there's not enough time for all the fun stuff I want to do, because of all the stuff I HAVE to do?!)

And - ps - my computer is dead. I'm using my work computer in the evenings to catch up on emails and posts, but not every night, so I may not be able to respond right away, but I'll be reading!

\:\) Thanks much!

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#1000314 - 07/17/08 10:57 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Debbie57 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 258
Loc: Kansas

I always feel like I've got too many irons in the fire myself and stress over it, even if they are things I like. AND, I'm well aware many more people juggle far more things than I do. I just get anxious about it and perhaps the other person is more able to not view the things as pressuring as I do. I don't know how we get past our own internal nature.

I cheat on housework. It always looks tidy, but for heaven's sake don't go looking for dust:). Since I love to read (any junk novel is just about fine) it's my way of relaxing. Often I take two hours out on a Sunday afternoon, make some popcorn and simply read. Hint, this is the perfect time to do laundry:).

I obviously have no great advise, but understand your struggle. Personally I would never sign on for anything else that involved a "class". The other place I can relax is actually at the piano - finally. Remember, I'm the one that cried at my last lesson and got some pressure taken off myself (that was only of my own making to begin with)to try and not do so much at once. It was liberating and I'm feeling so much more positive about my pieces and my own practice.

Sorry for the novel,

A Hero is one who hangs on one minute longer. Author: Unknown

#1000315 - 07/17/08 11:09 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Monica K. Offline

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012

Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 18126
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
My favorite form of non-piano relaxation is reading. Right now I'm working my way through Peter Hamilton's massive Reality Dysfunction series.

Physical exercise is one of the best ways to battle stress. After a nice long run, it's quite easy to relax. \:D And it's good for you, too.
Mason & Hamlin A -- 91997
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/pianomonica

#1000316 - 07/17/08 11:22 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
sotto voce Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/15/06
Posts: 6163
Loc: Briarcliff Manor, NY, USA
If you have pets, I recommend trying to dedicate some quality time to interacting with them regularly. Once they've become an established part of the household, it's easy to take their presence for granted; instead, let it be therapeutic.

I find it refreshing to try to see the world through my dog's eyes at least occasionally. Anything seems to make dogs happy, and they are always "in the moment"—which allows me to feel that way, too.

And what could be more relaxing than idle moments with a purring or snoozing cat on one's lap?

I hope this doesn't seem lame! It's said that interaction with our animals is good for our health (and, needless to say, they enjoy it, too).


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#1000317 - 07/18/08 12:45 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
As you walk (you do walk do you?) slow down your pace. Most people stiffen one ankle. Feel them both flick up as each leg leaves the ground. It should eventually transfer to your wrists.
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.

#1000318 - 07/18/08 01:39 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
sleepingcats Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/30/04
Posts: 982
Loc: Oregon
Originally posted by sotto voce:

And what could be more relaxing than idle moments with a purring or snoozing cat on one's lap?

I hope this doesn't seem lame! It's said that interaction with our animals is good for our health (and, needless to say, they enjoy it, too).

Steven [/b]
I agree. Sometimes I'll just rest my head on the belly of any of my cats and they start purring. I spoil them all badly, but they make me happy.

Also, working in my yard helps; pulling just a few weeds or picking a bowlful of blueberries from a bush in my backyard. Brain food!

I have so many "relaxation CDs"; I've even gone to bed listening to them with headphones on. Here are some I have for relaxing:

Stress Relief - nice CD given to me
Pianist Alan Roubik - interesting about the effect of his music on water crystals
Snatam Kaur - found this CD by accident; I've never listened to music like this before, but her voice & chants are hypnotic to me
Feng Shui music - another CD given to me

Do you have the funds and some extra time in your already busy schedule to get a massage once in awhile? How about acupuncture, which can help with stress relief (and many other things).

Hope you find something that helps you.
"Cats make purrfect friends"

#1000319 - 07/18/08 01:39 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
mr_super-hunky Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 4289

From what you describe, it sounds as though you may be a bit tightly wound. That does'nt mean stressed out or nutty, just a bit anxious.

Like you, I can get extremely "wound" up at times; often for no apparant reason. Shortness of breath, mind going in 10 different directions thinking about numerous different things at once.

They do make anxiety medication for exactly this condition (Xanax), but be warned it will knock you out and you may feel very dopey for a while.

Have you tried other options of calming down such as a glass of wine or alike?. Are you getting good restful deep REM sleep? Does heartburn keep you up at night?. Are you mentally taking your job home with you and thinking about things all night instead of sleeping?.

Obviously there could be many reasons for you to be a bit wound up at times and to solve the problem you must first determine what are the issues that are making you restless. Again, it could be poor sleep caused by a lousy bed or just you thinking too much. It could be your bodies reaction to eating poorly and not getting proper nutrition. It could be a lot of things.

Like you, I also get "wound" up at times and how I deal with it is to do something compatible to my state of mind at the time.

If I'm wide awake and full of energy I'll try and transfer that energy into something useful like getting things done around the house, lifting weights, running the dog....anything that drain some of that energy in a positive manner.

Still, doing these things is really just a bandaid for some other underlying problem that caused me to be wound up in the first place.

Again, try as hard as you can to determine what is getting you so worked up and deal with that issue head on.

Just a few things that I do that helps out a great deal:

.Get the best sleep you possibly can. I have a totally dark room and turn the bathroom fan on for white background noise. This constant fan noise really helps me sleep a great deal as I don't get distracted by other sounds in the house at night. Also sleep on a very good bed/mattress.

.Get proper nutrition and eat healthy and take a daily vitamin supplement for anything you may be lacking.

.Don't eat anything after a normal dinner time. If you don't eat after say 6 p:m, you won't be reliving your meal all night. Also if you get heartburn while sleeping, try NOT to sleep on your right side. Left side is better but on your back is best.

.Try playing piano when you are in a relaxed compatible state. I play my best when I am very tired.

.Don't take naps during the day but rather keep a relatively constant time cycle. Our bodies love to be on a regular clock.

Take this info for what you paid for it but realize that sometimes all it takes is just a few minor adjustments to get dialed in! .

#1000320 - 07/18/08 01:45 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Just some of the things I enjoy away from the piano.....

Collecting and using folding cameras

Part of my recovery from anxiety (caused by stress, worry and lack of relaxation) some time ago was to find a quiet room, lie down. Breath in through the nose and breath out through the mouth - you must ensure that the breath OUT is longer and sustained. Try it, its great! 15minutes every day.

#1000321 - 07/18/08 03:26 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Jamie147 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/05/08
Posts: 213
Loc: England, UK
How do I stop wood pigeons eating all the food I throw out as they are so greedy. They scoff everything in sight.
We are the melodies and the notes of your opus. We are the music of your life.

#1000322 - 07/18/08 04:22 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Just leave out a little.........

#1000323 - 07/18/08 07:36 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Oxfords Gal Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/21/06
Posts: 1553
Loc: Jacksonville, Florida
hi saerra,

I find several ways to relax that echo many of the posters suggestions.

I go for a 2 mile walk with 2 of my doggies to relax. It certainly relaxes them and me.

I also interact with them to relax. Some of the stuff they do is just pure comedy and if they're not up to funny business I create my own by pretending to scold the Airedale, and when I do the Scotty, scolds me right back and follows me into every room growling at me (in a fun way) and that puts me in stitches. Talk about weird huh?

In this image here Stanley, was catching flies that came into the house the second we opened the door. I find it quite funny to watch him. Laughter is truly the best medicine for me to relax.

Bogie, will put his head down and rooo rooo at me and he totally relaxes me. :p

another way is reading. I have a subscription to Ellery Queen and Alfred Hitchcocks little mystery magazines and I get engrossed in them.

Usually I'll do my house chores first then I'll do stuff to relax. Once you have the obligatory stuff out of the way it's easy to relax.
Fuzzy Wuzzy was a bear, Fuzzy Wuzzy had no hair.>>> Herman Munster

#1000324 - 07/18/08 08:00 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Jamie147 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/05/08
Posts: 213
Loc: England, UK
I've been in overdrive on the keyboard recently playing it every spare minute but recently I've slowed down a bit which I'm happy with. Before if I was doing anything but making music I would be restless but now I can go the whole weekend without playing a note. I play every evening during the week so sometimes I just don't feel like it.

I'm becoming an expert at relaxing after learning from Homer Simpson and Andy Capp. \:D
We are the melodies and the notes of your opus. We are the music of your life.

#1000325 - 07/18/08 08:18 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Debbie57 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 258
Loc: Kansas
Darling dogs Oxford Gal! I also have pets in my life that assist with relaxing. My oldest cockatoo loves to have her head preened. I find that as I do it for her, I myself relax. Dedicated Capella time. How could I possibly do anything else:)

Jamie, sounds like you've found the ticket by slowing down a little. Maybe it's just a new learner syndrome. I have this new piano, I started learning so I push myself to try and get "good at it" very quickly?? My teacher's comment will stay with me for a long time. Basically she said that by pushing myself so hard to get every element perfect, I was "stealing the joy of the music" from myself.
A Hero is one who hangs on one minute longer. Author: Unknown

#1000326 - 07/18/08 08:27 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
LaValse Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/21/07
Posts: 1225
Loc: Mumbles, Wales
Well, I have to be honest, I like going to the pub and drinking quite a lot of ale...

#1000327 - 07/18/08 09:01 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Donna R. Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 794
I read, mostly mysteries and historical novels. I play soccer with my dog with a nutty US-football-shaped squeaky ball that he adores because it positively wails every time one of us crushes it. I go for a decidedly un-power walk every day somewhere quiet where I can listen to the birds and feel the breeze on my face and let my mind unravel (except when the dog is trying to help himself to roadkill, then things get somewhat more tense), and I go for similarly un-power bike rides that involve a lot of delicious free-wheeling after I've sweated up a hill just so that I can have the pleasure of not having to pedal at all coming down the other side!

Seriously, I think getting some fresh air and some moderate exercise doing something that you enjoy, not just burning calories for the sake of it, helps a great deal.

#1000328 - 07/18/08 09:42 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Fitswimmer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/16/07
Posts: 122
Loc: Florida
I agree with all of you who mentioned pets! I have 3 cats, but this year I also added two fishtanks to my livestock assortment and I really am enjoying them! I have a tank with 2 goldfish in the bedroom and a tropical tank in the LR with a colorful assortment of active fish. Watching them and doing the routine maintenance is very relaxing and satisfying. Of course, petting the kitties and playing with them is wonderful too.

As you can tell by my username, I swim for exercise and I find that very relaxing and stimulating at the same time.
I have a deep and satisfying relationship with my Yamaha U1...

#1000329 - 07/18/08 11:29 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
gooddog Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 5442
Loc: Seattle area, WA
All great advice. I'd like to add needlework (cross stitch, needlepoint, etc) to the list. It requires a lot of concentration but gives you time to sit quietly and think.

It's also helpful to prioritize and let some stuff drop off the edge, like cleaning. My father used to say, "I could be dead tomorrow", meaning, do today what really matters because tomorrow your life could end.
Best regards,


#1000330 - 07/18/08 03:13 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Gyro Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 4534
In my experience, one of the biggest sources
of the inability to relax is unnatural breathing.
When we are young children, we breathe
naturally, that is, we never think about
it or are concscious of it. Breathing
is one of those body functions that is
completely involuntary, like your heartbeat
or blinking your eyes. And as young
children breathing is like this, completely
involuntary and unconscious, that is,
completely natural.

However, as we get older, and life gets
more complicated and stressful, there
is a tendency to make breathing into an
unnatural--that is, voluntary--activity
that is controlled by you consciously.
The dangers in this should be apparent:
breathing is an involuntary body function;
making it into a voluntary one is
unnatural--for example, what would
happen if you made your heartbeat into
a voluntary function? You wouldn't
be able to sleep anymore and you'd soon
be dead.

Looking to mediation or yoga for relaxation
only makes things worse, because they stress
controlled--that is, unnatural--breathing,
and what you should be aiming for is
returning your breathing to what is should
be, which is unconscious and involuntary.
Therefore, I consider all activities that
encourage conscious awareness of your
breathing to be harmful: yoga, meditation,
Asian martial arts, Western-style
deep breathing exercises, Tai Chi,
taking deep breaths to "relax," etc.

You should never be conscious of your
breathing at any time. I speak from
personal experience here. As soon as
I let my breathing return to being
a completely unconscious and involuntary
activity, like it should be, a host
of chronic health problems disappeared
overnight, as if by magic.

#1000331 - 07/18/08 03:40 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Babs_ Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/12/07
Posts: 321
Loc: Gulf Coast
Have you tried walking? ;\)

I walk 6 to 7 hours a week. I would walk more if I had the time. I either walk very early in the morning or right at sunset. I have discovered that I play better after an hourly walk. While I am walking I focus on breathing well and relaxing all the muscles in my hands .

Earlier in the week it did nothing but rain down here for 3 days. I had to give up my outdoor walking for 3 days and as a result my piano playing suffered noticeably. Finally when the sun came out, I was able to resume my daily walking and I noticed that those issues that I had earlier in the week with my Scarlatti piece had finally been resolved.

#1000332 - 07/18/08 06:55 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Lisztener Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/12/06
Posts: 921

Like Babs_, I find that walking two miles per day (treadmill during weather extremes) four times per week at a speed that makes me break a sweat helps with my concentration. My problem then becomes to sit at the piano frequently enough for the walking to benefit my play. :rolleyes: \:D

Good luck,


#1000333 - 07/18/08 08:15 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
KaylaX Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/14/08
Posts: 420
Loc: N. Cali
I like to scrapbook. Or if the weather is decent ( im a fairweather rider), I will saddle up my horse and go for a ride in my backyard, or sometimes I might just have a glass of wine. Usually a glass of wine, its a lot easier to get up a get!!!!!

Its been 7 years since ive played. But im back, and I have a teacher and im excited !!! and finally...a Baby Grand !!! Cheap & used, but I LOVE its sound smile

#1000334 - 07/18/08 08:17 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Rerun Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/28/07
Posts: 1170
Loc: Louisiana
Start looking at your time with the piano as a vacation.....it's about the fun. \:\)

"Seat of the pants piano player" DMD

#1000335 - 07/18/08 08:37 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Less Rubato Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/23/08
Posts: 266
Loc: Washington state via OH-IO

I agree about needlepoint--although I am more of a hand piecer. I start an elaborate project at the beginning of football season. It keeps me relaxed while watching my favorite team .That says a lot because my favorite team loses frequently. Relaxing at the piano is a piece of cake compared to that!

#1000336 - 07/19/08 01:28 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Key Notes Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 744
Loc: CA
Hi Saerra,

It's really too bad that you are feeling so stressed out, to the point of not even knowing which day it is when you wake up. I sincerely hope that you'll find solutions to help you unwind soon, as well as getting your computer issues fixed.

As for me, besides my regular exercises and fun activities, I also just love lying there and closing my eyes while listening to relaxing and beautiful piano music. I wish I can find time to do this more often.

Good luck to you.

Key Notes \:\)
Music speaks where words fails.

#1000337 - 07/19/08 10:52 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
Stay out of tense places - traffic - use an alternate route - use back or side roads - go at a diffrent time of day.

Plan a reward (small) for yourself every day - or several times a day. Think of a sliced, cold orange served on a plate, add slided onions, pineapple chunks, or grapefruit sections (canned for ease). Maybe add some nuts. Enjoy the preparation - savor the eating of natural foods in their closest states to nature.

Another reward for me is mango sherbet that Haggen Dazs sells in little packages. I get two servings from one. To fancy it up add coconut and pine nuts. Let it be refreshing and the icy spoon helps. Same thing works for me with pina coloda yogurt.

In the winter my comfort food is minestrone soup with a thick piece of buttered bread (roll). Some food will speak to you, and it will be more than eating for nourishment, it will be an event.
Let's be truthful. Use a small amount of that food for your reward.

I have sometimes in my life turned the telephone down so I can't hear the ring and let the answering machine get it. Then I answered call when I could handle them, not when they interrupted something in progress, or put me on the spot to answer now. Protect your self.

Deep breathing with a longer exhale. Rocking chair where you are snuggled back, I use a small comforter too, eyes closed, slowly rocking. Concentrate on rock, rock, rock, rock - clear your mind. Combined with breathing, you should be warm and relaxed after 10 minutes of that - or asleep.

Vitamin D from the sun. Soak it up for a minumin of 20 minutes if you can. Don't abuse being in the sun for too long.

Drop your jaw let it hang but don't force it open.

Approve of yourself - congratulate yourself - laugh at yourself - root for you - reward yourself.

Learn to be idle for given periods of time. Learn how long a chore really takes. Prevention of a problem is much better than having to find a solution to a problem.

If you asked me what was the biggest thing on my mind at the moment, I would say getting the burned out light bulbs replaced. I need ladder climbing people to do that for me.

I consider this to be a passive thought and if I continued thinking about chores and to do's I could put myself into a tizzy. So I won't go there - a long "to do" list already exists for things like that.

Think of something pleasant that happened today: I saw a gentleman who is an excellent theory teacher and musician for less than 5 minutes today. We were among many others who were also teaching and coaching music classes this weekend. I see him very seldom because we are in different countries, but we had our greeting and smiles and handshakes, and that felt really go. The celebration being: "Here we are again, doing what we do, and I see you are thriving as ever!" Simple thought, but very heart warming.

Simple joys, simple pleasures!


#1000338 - 07/20/08 01:08 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
Key Notes Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 744
Loc: CA
So many good advises here that I can also use. Fabulous!

(I think I'm using too many "fabulous". \:D )
Music speaks where words fails.

#1000339 - 07/20/08 01:15 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
ROMagister Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/26/08
Posts: 518
Loc: Bucuresti, Romania
I sort of inadvertently relaxed about 3 weeks away from a "proper" keyboard...

this is because I went to (late) grandparents' mountain village home with older 4-octave narrow key[/b] "toy" keyboard - thought it took much less space - and it did, but nothing else good.

On trying to practice from Faber's book 2, quickly found trying to jump intervals larger than a fifth disrupts "proper finger memory" (compared to the standard keyboard that I already got more practice on) and resolved not to try to train fast on it. Or just my excuse for plain laziness ? ;-)

Still tried improving 'ear memory' trying a few slow 'chord progressions'. Another fun exercise was to try to listen the CD's while following the scores in the book (eyes hearing only !).

#1000340 - 07/21/08 08:46 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
saerra Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/28/07
Posts: 842
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Thanks everyone, definitely a lot to think about. It's really fascinating to see the different things that people find relaxing (and I LOVED the puppy pictures, by the way!)

I think I'm just overwhelmed right now. I know I've mentioned it, but I bought my first home a few months ago and honestly, I do not think I am meant to be a homeowner. It has really increased my stress by an order of magnitude. I was working hard to save money previously (so that when I figure out what I want to do with my life, I can have a good financial cushion to make it happen) - and now, I just don't see how people manage to save money while they have a house - there is ALWAYS something either breaking, or about to break (that needs to be budgeted for) or that generally needs improving. It's expensive.

On top of that, stress at work, the computer not working, and general trying to do too many other things at once is making me feel a little crazier than usual.

But I appreciate all the advice and will try to figure out what will work for me ;\) definitely more high-quality sleep (and probably less sugar)...

Thanks \:\)

#1000341 - 07/21/08 09:23 PM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
IrishMak Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/20/06
Posts: 1614
Loc: New Hampshire, USA

If what you really need to do is slow down and STOP to relieve stress and tension, I would highly recommend yoga and, especially, meditation. Just make sure you are doing one of the more meditative, slow, relaxed, stretching types of yoga, not a "power yoga" type. The problem I always found with walking, biking, etc types of exercise (and I do use my elliptical and do weight training and walk the dog) is that it is too easy to let the tension and "gotta get it done" attitude take over, and then you are going at full speed again. The more meditative types of relaxation therapy really do force you to slow down and focus inside. Just realize that it will take time. I've done meditation for years and it still is very hard some days to lose the mental flurry and focus on nothing. But it really does work.

1889 Mason & Hamlin screwstringer upright
Kawai MP-4 digital

When life hands you lemons, throw them back and add some of your own. Stupid life.

#1000342 - 07/22/08 01:42 AM Re: Relaxing (away from the piano)
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
Originally posted by IrishMak:
I've done meditation for years and it still is very hard some days to lose the mental flurry and focus on nothing. But it really does work. [/b]
Good points but there isn't any 'nothing' to focus on. I find too many yoga practitioners concentrate on the stretch. That will happen naturally. If you push it you start re-enforcing habitual uses. Focus on balance instead.
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.

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Kawai mp11 problem.
by Knario
04/24/17 04:28 AM
Steigerman baby grand with piano disc player
by Lorianna203
04/23/17 10:43 PM
Found a George Steck baby grand with 1779 stamped on the leg
by Lorianna203
04/23/17 10:08 PM
Would you buy this Hobart Cable baby grand?
by Lorianna203
04/23/17 09:51 PM
The Graded Rameau
by kaziranga
04/23/17 09:32 PM
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